A theory...

[Harris]

y'all sound like a bunch of wine sippers.

guzzle.


Nothing being made that's fat is for BC. You cant travel 15 miles to and from a place on fat flat lead weights.

If all you are doinf is skinning straight up some ridgeline to the straight downiest place, then young and strong can get there if you put shackles on them. But that aint Backcountry. They done screwed all the names up. And I aint young and strong.

I want old ski profiles a little more than tongue depressors. I am a bow legged hillbilly but don't these new designs kinda force kinda a "wide stance". A lot of frontal area too. tips don't turn up much. EXCEPT for powder, most of the new skis look like they kinda suck. And what are they using for bindings? They suck too.

Nobody can run with that kinda weight in the BC, and nobody can do BC on what are now running skis. I saw a used set of extremes (boots) the other day, and I should of bought them. By modern standards an extreme is a damn hot boot. And you can't say nobody could ski them, they went downhill quite well at the speeds you actually reach in the actual backcountry. Not downhill, lift served anything, backcountry. There is no such thing as lift served backcountry, look around. If you ain't walking, if you are seeing a lot of snowboarders, if you are seeing a lot of people and no dogs, you aren't in the backcountry.

Everybody loves the perfect ski for the trip they do, but nobody seems to be emphasing mine. And whats with the gear costing much more than equivalent downhill gear? That ratio used to be reversed. I mean THOUSANDS for skis and bindings that only fit one boot, A boot that easily cost 500 more. I think everybody want to be the ski manufacturer to the Rich, and nobody want to sell gear that would actually sell to enough people that the areas were again being used as a mass recreation. In the 70's ski areas got big popular. Now not so much. Wonder why?

I want a glu-on set bottom kit. Something that would let you plane out a small channel and fill it with a decent kick strip good enough to run laps on a 500 foot hill without needing to completely skin up and kill all hope of glide and liteness.. Anybody know where I can get ptex step? MAKE the damn things myself outta old goodwill remnants. They never did produce enough step bottoms, nobody really wants to walk any more.

Anybody seen a used pair of head 360 or comps? In black? Anybody?

I have a nearly brand new pair of vintage but closet stored 203 length 75 mm width Kazama Outback TMs that just might float your boat.

[oggopoggo]

I think the F17 Classic is a very, very good idea. I would say great idea except that I haven't skied Harts yet. What binding would you put on it?

I had the old round flexing Rossi 7M (with pins) which was better than any tele ski I could find and much later the ID One mogul (with pins-that was wild, then cable). There was a big change in bump skis over that period, much narrower and stiffer in the tail that made them less versatile unless you could pressure the nose. I gather that competition skis became slightly wider with more sidecut after the F17 Classic appeared. I imagine the tail still has some bite.

[Rokjox]

I just don't ski enough to have any experiemce in some ways. When I get a pair of skis, I am on them for the next few years. Or decades. A simple google shows the F17 is screwy hot ski right now, but I got no idea what that would be like.

But refitting and remaking some well preserved downhill boards into reporposed BC gear whould seem to be an idea coming of age again. The 203's are a little lomg for my local woodsy tangle, I am skiing about 180's now to shave weight, despite being fat and crrying a pack with a minimum 1/2 sixpack. And all the other stuff...

I remember a ski with a "hex" aluminum core a long time ago, they were very light by the times. Who made that, I can't seem to google it. We used downhill scrap from dumps allthe time. ( I just spent 30 min. looking for a certain photo, no luck)

If I can just put some steps on the bottom, I think I can equal just about whats being made at prices I can't afford... find me some used Rotts...

[MikeK]

I am skiing about 180's now to shave weight, despite being fat and crrying a pack with a minimum 1/2 sixpack.

Dude... get yerself a couple ten fidy's to shave that weight:



10.5% Does the job of two (maybe 3) regular beers. Tastes friggin' great (like coffee and molasses). Comes in a can (easy to crush and carry out). It's cheaper than new skis too!

[jzahnny]

So what ski is out there for us routinely lift serviced types looking for a go to addition for the quiver? I'm thinking the Hart F17 Classic. It is springy and it edges well. It just might be the telemark version of the alpine slalom ski for a regular day, resort area ski. Thoughts?

I'm looking at the Blizzard Latigo for a dedicated frontside Tele. Thoughts?

Lenghts: 163-170-177-184 cm
Sidecut: 115-78-102 mm
Radius: 18.0 m (177 cm)

I'm a newb and stay mostly on piste because that's where I can consistently work on the turn. The many Tele skiers I see here on groomers (Alpine Meadows mostly) are doing everything from ripping to cruising non pow days with 3 or 4-buckle boots, Axl/Vice or NTN and fat boards (minimum 95). They make it look effortless. But for me, no. I can get 90s to 102s on edge with my T2s in the Axl or Vice or X2, but it's difficult and I think I'm compromising other facets of my learning by focusing on driving the wide skis. The other day a friend put me on his 181cm 2008 K2 World Pistes (80 waist) with mid-stiff 01s and what a revelation. Suddenly balance was more important and turning was light and fun.

[Harris]

[quote="jzahnny"]

I'm looking at the Blizzard Latigo for a dedicated frontside Tele. Thoughts?

Lenghts: 163-170-177-184 cm
Sidecut: 115-78-102 mm
Radius: 18.0 m (177 cm)

I'm not familiar with those skis, but I think looking at the turn radius is key. 18m turn radius is going to be a lot more turny fun than say a 24m radius ski; a 24m is going to want to rail, and that in my opinion really limits the skiing. You can snap a long radius ski around quick inbounds, but it is going to fight you. I'm currently/recently riding 177cm K2 Pinnacle 95s. They are a pretty fat tipped (130mm) ski but with a 95mm waist and boast a 17m turn radius. They ski much better than my old BD Havocs, which are a 25m turn radius ski (or somewhere in that measure), and I attribute a lot of that to the shorter turn radius of the K2s as well as their camber. But I'm not a ski engineer. What I do know is that I can do things on these skis that my Havocs balked against. The only thing that I would not use them on is ice; they are too fat of a ski to make edging hard easy. For that I'd go with a pure bred slalom ski. However... On that, for us on NTN going narrower than 85mm waist presents a binding mount problem. I think Atomic Redster SL have a 65mm waist. My step-in cams on the Outlaw bindings require at least 85mm to contact the top sheet. I think the narrowest Rott NTN binding brakes are 85mm. Etc, Etc...

[Harris]

I just don't ski enough to have any experiemce in some ways. When I get a pair of skis, I am on them for the next few years. Or decades. A simple google shows the F17 is screwy hot ski right now, but I got no idea what that would be like.

find me some used Rotts...

The problem I realized with the F17s is that the waist is going to be too narrow to mount my NTN bindings. Same with any sub 85mm waisted ski. Unfortunately it is all about the fat these days.

I remember the Hex core ski advertisements (1980s), but I can't recall the MFG. They weren't simply called "Hexagon" were they?

[Rokjox]

It's scary how old my gear is.

I am still skiing stuff that was sold 25 years ago. Or if not, well, its still hanging on the wall like I do. High Route rossi skis, excursions are my modern boot, K2 is made all my skis for ages, skiied at a lift Yesterday or so, used the yella Heli's with rots' bought for about 100 bucks somewhere, I don't reecall, but I never pay more than that. Got a almost the same pair a couple mill's skinier, couple years older, color is the evil superman scheme with bulldogs for rock skis. K2 been making the same ski for a long time?


Here is my buddies closet, he never sells anything, but the worst just does get moved out into the garage.

left side

right side

I been trying to talk him outta the blue fishers, he never ever even skis that low in the quiver any longer. Only way I ever bought a new ski was after selling something else. This guy had too much money compared to me. But tell me this. How you gonna sell this guy another ski? Hard to justify a 500 dollar binding using minimalist cables, too especially to a bunch of cheap B. peak trudgers. Is there just no money left in it at this level? WHAY to expensive stuuf what is avaliable, too. Wasn't mass production supposed to bring costs DOWN?



What does a pair of outtabounds or some such cost wholesale, anyway? How much dinero IS there in selling a rig of flat feet?

[Markrd350]

I skied harts f17 as a everyday all mt alpine ski years and loved them . That how I found this post . I’m a resort skier on the east coast Western New York. I’m skiing hart’s attacks skis as my tele ski but I think the f17 would be more fun more responsive on groomers. If anyone tries them let me know. I’ve been skiing harts for the last 30 years I guess ,not sure what I will do now that they only do mogul skis

[yakdog]

Rokjox - your memory of an aluminum core ski might be Hexcel Skis. Hexcel is still in business but they no longer make skis. The skis will show up in google with some old pics ...