THE GREATEST bindings debate on the planet (Official thread)

[Raventele]

Uhhh, say what?
Rocker launch usually refers to the ramping upwards
of most (all to some extent) duckbills on 75mm boots..
There are some advantages in that ramping..

[bogon]

You must be joking. Advantages?

[Raventele]

Not at all..for example, If you force the whole boot down
exactly how early and how much leverage there is
against the binding depends to some extent on how
the duckbill is ramped or "rockered"..
and I would add that the duckbill's rocker is used as a lever
for helping break the bellows ...
Also if you think you cannot pitch forward on your head on ANY tele
type binding, you're just wrong..

[bogon]

I can't get it. Can You rephrase?

Besides, I haven't tasted the tips of my skis mounted with NTN Freeride yet, having done a couple of unintentional front flips on 'em (mind You they're 192cm). No knee damage either.

[Johnny]

I like debates...
I predict that in twenty years, we will still be debating over the exact same things... (Which is fun...!)

The fact is, modern gear has made us a bunch of wimps by comparison.

Except for us, pinheads from hell...

[Raventele]

I can't get it. Can You rephrase?

Besides, I haven't tasted the tips of my skis mounted with NTN Freeride yet, having done a couple of unintentional front flips on 'em (mind You they're 192cm). No knee damage either.

do you have a pin-type binding mounted on a ski?
If so take a 75mm boot and lock it in..push down on the boot so as to make
the whole sole touch the ski.. Watch how the duckbill behaves and when and where it "catches"
against the bail..eventually it locks down with strong leverage against the bail..great for parallels..
Tip the boot up and see how the duckbill works with the binding in the case of a tele..
A perfectly flat (not rockered) duckbill would not be desirable in either case..

[gfwp]

Yeah and minners used to ski 14 foot skis and hit 80 miles per hour....turns that's for wimps....stop....shiiiiiii........This year got some beater e109's....nice ski....ripped off the small lifter and the ski was even better....Teleking and I wanna nail some leather (naturally) sandals onto the ski and....ski....less is best...TM

Ahhaaaa!

It sounds like you picked my hint
What about these E109? For me great.

I've followed the hint and got Svartisen 75 to match the E109, but there is bad weather, high alavanche
risk and 6 meters snow; all resorts closed. I have to wait for further testing.

Please, fill out my thread in earnyouturns

cheers

gfwp

[Saint Jocko]

Personally, I think some old Birkenstock sandals bolted to a Fischer E109 would make a good "Krautenski" setup. Just run a bungee cord around your heel when you want to carve some downhill turns. I think in a twisting fall it would qualify as a release binding. Should work really well while wearing traditional liederhosen. Should be able to chase down a red stag in the Black Forest. Grab an old Mauser K98 rifle and head for the mountains. I can almost taste those red stag backstraps now with the German Bock beer.

After seeing what those Altai Mountain skiers could do to the elk with their lassoes and homemade skis in National Geographic, I have been eyeing the excess mule deer around here and I can just smell those backstraps sizzling on the barbie. I might just stop into Rowdy's Ridin', Ropin' and Repair and pick up a lasso.....

Those Altai Mountain guys SWORE to the National Geographic journalist that since hunting the elk was illegal now, they were only capturing that elk for his article......but the guy looked mighty practiced and efficient for a guy that had "given up" elk poaching some time ago. When was the last time YOU chased down an elk on homemade skis, and a National Geographic journalist got photos of the event? Would a National Geographic journalist NOT laugh in your face if you made him the photo-op offer using your high-tech gear? A couple of the photos of those Chinamen eating a feast at home told me that I've been slumming in comparison. I had a bowl of chili tonight. And just WHERE did those elk shin skins for the bottom of his new homemade skis come from??? My Rottweiler-German Shepherd mix dog chased down and threw down 5 mule deer in one year a while back.....and one of the mule deer was trying to stomp him.....and he has NO skis and NO lasso.....just a Rottweiler jaw with German Shepherd attitude behind it. I made him let them all go, and one deer was down in the river that was icing out in the early spring. I guess he is one up on those Altai Mountain skiers but I'm starting to feel like a wuss by comparison..... Chinamen and a dog have shown me a thing or two.

[bogon]

do you have a pin-type binding mounted on a ski?

No, but, as the bomb said "my memory is good on matters like these".

push down on the boot so as to make
the whole sole touch the ski..

You mean push the heel down those 2''?

Watch how the duckbill behaves and when and where it "catches"
against the bail..

In that Cobra, it is in good contact from the beginning. Only You get throwed on Your face by rocker launch (pardonne mois english - non-native speaker).

eventually it locks down with strong leverage against the bail..great for parallels..

To me, it seems quite the contrary. While the boot wedges duckbill into toe, it does so only because heel throw applies forward pressure (preload). But that won't stop the boot itself from twisting laterally, right?

Besides, that heavy, ever-cracking NTN Freedom Aluminum frame holds the white flex plate from sides, and I do believe that this is far, far better for parallels. At least I can not feel the negative difference judging against, say, Dynafit or current Marker (god forbid) offerings.

Tip the boot up and see how the duckbill works with the binding in the case of a tele..

Then the boot starts to twist even more - only one point of contact at the heel, and I suspect that You'll get squirreling ski because of that.

Double-barreled bindings might not have this behavior, but I do not know for sure.

A perfectly flat (not rockered) duckbill would not be desirable in either case..

Why? I believe that at least one 75mm binding actually helps to break bellows (given the duckbill, against which it leverages).

NTN, OTOH, helps breaking bellows even better.
But they had to address boot twisting by overbuilding the boot mold AFAIK.

[Teleman]

Telekid riding leathers pins and Outtabounds.....If Ron puts them up....lateral just out and out doesn't apply....leather boots have energy....twist left and it builds.....stomp down the heel and the tips respond....lift your heel and the boot sits FLAT on the balls of your feet....that can't be done on plastic....and no intentional put downs here....Then there is the fun factor....the crash factor....TM