Physics debate

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TallGrass
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Re: Physics debate

Post by TallGrass » Mon Jan 09, 2023 7:12 pm

wabene wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:35 pm
Your right GS that I'm just learning the turn.
Edit: Geez Louise, I cannot believe this discussion continues... the endurance exhibited is remarkable :shock:
Says the man who has been "just learning the turn" for about two years. :?
GrimSurfer wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:22 pm
In another thread, @wabene mentions going over his tips a few times. We’ve all done this at some point, and it’s a sign of being waay too far forward on our skis...
... or breaking a trench in deep snow near a pass, stopping to pull out a trail map to study on a oh-so-"negligible" incline in the "meadow" only to have your skis decide to try "reverse gear".
*mmfff*
*mmmm-mmmffff*
*click*
*waffle*
*click* *kick*
*wallow*
[Snowshoes from pack to feet, skis from ... where the hell did they go?... dig dig ... to pack]
...

Image

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wabene
Posts: 716
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2021 9:53 am
Location: Duluth Minnesota
Ski style: Stiff kneed and wide eyed.
Favorite Skis: Åsnes Gamme, Fischer SB98, Mashus M50, M78, Pano M62
Favorite boots: Crispi Svartsen 75mm, Scarpa T4
Occupation: Carpenter

Re: Physics debate

Post by wabene » Mon Jan 09, 2023 7:40 pm

TallGrass wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 7:12 pm
wabene wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:35 pm
Your right GS that I'm just learning the turn.
Edit: Geez Louise, I cannot believe this discussion continues... the endurance exhibited is remarkable :shock:
Says the man who has been "just learning the turn" for about two years. :?
GrimSurfer wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:22 pm
In another thread, @wabene mentions going over his tips a few times. We’ve all done this at some point, and it’s a sign of being waay too far forward on our skis...
... or breaking a trench in deep snow near a pass, stopping to pull out a trail map to study on a oh-so-"negligible" incline in the "meadow" only to have your skis decide to try "reverse gear".
*mmfff*
*mmmm-mmmffff*
*click*
*waffle*
*click* *kick*
*wallow*
[Snowshoes from pack to feet, skis from ... where the hell did they go?... dig dig ... to pack]
...

Image
I'm not sure how to take this strange post, but that's ok, sometimes you have to let art flow over you, :lol: .

It got me thinking, how long have I been trying this turn. I found the video my pal shot from the first time I was out date stamped April 9th 2022. Today is my 9 month anniversary! Just crawling out of the tele womb so to speak! Only 6 sessions so far, but I got the bit in my mouth this year so let's go!

Never stop learning my friends :D



mca80
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Location: Da UP eh
Ski style: Over the river and through the woods
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Re: Physics debate

Post by mca80 » Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:18 pm

wabene wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:35 pm
Your right GS that I'm just learning the turn. I think it's @mca80 that's getting the ski lessons up on Da UP! I doubt you could even get tele lessons around here, :lol: . That's alright, I'm hooked and I'll keep plugging away. Just taking a day off as I can barely move after a big weekend of skiing.


Edit: Geez Louise, I cannot believe this discussion continues... the endurance exhibited is remarkable :shock:
Yeah he confused you and I. As for endurance, keep in mind theres a lotta xc skiers here.



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wabene
Posts: 716
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Location: Duluth Minnesota
Ski style: Stiff kneed and wide eyed.
Favorite Skis: Åsnes Gamme, Fischer SB98, Mashus M50, M78, Pano M62
Favorite boots: Crispi Svartsen 75mm, Scarpa T4
Occupation: Carpenter

Re: Physics debate

Post by wabene » Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:20 pm

mca80 wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:18 pm
wabene wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:35 pm
Your right GS that I'm just learning the turn. I think it's @mca80 that's getting the ski lessons up on Da UP! I doubt you could even get tele lessons around here, :lol: . That's alright, I'm hooked and I'll keep plugging away. Just taking a day off as I can barely move after a big weekend of skiing.


Edit: Geez Louise, I cannot believe this discussion continues... the endurance exhibited is remarkable :shock:
Yeah he confused you and I. As for endurance, keep in mind theres a lotta xc skiers here.
:lol:



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GrimSurfer
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Re: Physics debate

Post by GrimSurfer » Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:27 pm

mca80 wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:18 pm
Yeah he confused you and I. As for endurance, keep in mind theres a lotta xc skiers here.
Ha ha. Funny one about XC skiers. Might have something to do with it.
We dreamed of riding waves of air, water, snow, and energy for centuries. When the conditions were right, the things we needed to achieve this came into being. Every idea man has ever had up to that point about time and space were changed. And it keeps on changing whenever we dream. Bio mechanical jazz, man.



mca80
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Favorite boots: Crispi Bre, Hook, Alpina 1600, Alico Ski March, Crispi Mountain

Re: Physics debate

Post by mca80 » Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:32 pm

GrimSurfer wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:27 pm
mca80 wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:18 pm
Yeah he confused you and I. As for endurance, keep in mind theres a lotta xc skiers here.
Ha ha. Funny one about XC skiers. Might have something to do with it…

Ok. So why do you think you went over the front of your skis?
I think you confuses us again. I have worked on tele turns two days and never gone over the handlebars. Close, once, but I am athletic and pulled it back.



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GrimSurfer
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Re: Physics debate

Post by GrimSurfer » Mon Jan 09, 2023 8:45 pm

Awesome. Good to hear.
We dreamed of riding waves of air, water, snow, and energy for centuries. When the conditions were right, the things we needed to achieve this came into being. Every idea man has ever had up to that point about time and space were changed. And it keeps on changing whenever we dream. Bio mechanical jazz, man.



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DG99
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Re: Physics debate

Post by DG99 » Tue Jan 10, 2023 3:47 pm

GrimSurfer wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 7:02 pm
DG99 wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:41 pm
GrimSurfer wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:24 pm


If you can point out how cables impart a force on the ski without violating the laws of physics, I’m all ears….
It’s a springy lever system

Oh… maybe you’re pointing out that the cables at rest don’t move by themselves, but rather just sit there unless some outside force imparts some kind of Newtonian force to them?
The cables are in tension. Whatever force is applied to them in one direction is equal to the force in another direction. Why. Because both ends are fixed to the same object.

There is only one outside force at play… gravity. The rest are just internal forces — weight (of the skier), friction (of the ski) and drag (skier’s coefficient)… if one excludes thrust (from poles).
You seem like you’re confusing the issue. Maybe explain more? The front end of the cables are fixed to the pivot points on the binding, not the tip of the boot.



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GrimSurfer
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Re: Physics debate

Post by GrimSurfer » Tue Jan 10, 2023 3:48 pm

DG99 wrote:
Tue Jan 10, 2023 3:47 pm
GrimSurfer wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 7:02 pm
DG99 wrote:
Mon Jan 09, 2023 6:41 pm


It’s a springy lever system

Oh… maybe you’re pointing out that the cables at rest don’t move by themselves, but rather just sit there unless some outside force imparts some kind of Newtonian force to them?
The cables are in tension. Whatever force is applied to them in one direction is equal to the force in another direction. Why. Because both ends are fixed to the same object.

There is only one outside force at play… gravity. The rest are just internal forces — weight (of the skier), friction (of the ski) and drag (skier’s coefficient)… if one excludes thrust (from poles).
You seem like you’re confusing the issue. Maybe explain more? The front end of the cables are fixed to the pivot points on the binding, not the tip of the boot.
I’ve explained it at length in this and another thread. Not being sniffy… just no sense covering old ground.

A few posts either side of these links are reasonable places to start.

https://www.telemarktalk.com/viewtopic ... =30#p54333

https://www.telemarktalk.com/viewtopic ... =40#p54349

https://www.telemarktalk.com/viewtopic ... 438#p54305

https://www.telemarktalk.com/viewtopic ... =40#p54508

The thing that I wish to make clear is that the cables DO impart a degree of CONTROL… stated several times throughout the discussion.

But control is not force.
We dreamed of riding waves of air, water, snow, and energy for centuries. When the conditions were right, the things we needed to achieve this came into being. Every idea man has ever had up to that point about time and space were changed. And it keeps on changing whenever we dream. Bio mechanical jazz, man.



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Stephen
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Re: Physics debate

Post by Stephen » Tue Jan 10, 2023 5:28 pm

@GrimSurfer, just checking what you mean by “Control?”
I don’t want to guess or assume — can you elaborate?
But maybe you already made that clear, earlier.

And, agree Control does not = Force.



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