Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

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Haydos
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon May 15, 2017 8:01 am

Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby Haydos » Sun Jul 16, 2017 9:41 am

Hey Guys,

Just after some opinions / advice...

Just bought some Volkl Kendo's to Resort / Slackcountry Tele on and am about to pre-order the Bishop BMF's.

I'm currently riding BD Havoc's and Hammerheads.

I'll be buying some fat powder boards shortly also, so instead of buying 2 x BMF's...

Should i run quiver killers or buy 2 of the 2nd ski kits for the BMF's?

Has anybody had problems with the QK's? (i'll get them mounted in a shop so I don't stuff it up!)

Thanks!

teleclub
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2016 4:49 pm
Location: Wasatch

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby teleclub » Fri Aug 11, 2017 2:36 pm

Installed Quiver Killers on four pairs of skis early last Winter and have had no problems. (Two pairs each for two skiers.)

It was a lot of work to do properly, especially because the NTN Freedom bindings use eleven screws/QKs (!).

To me, QKs come into their real value when your binding of choice doesn't offer a 2nd ski kit or if the 2nd Ski kit is a lot more money than the QK kit.

I have switched bindings back and forth a couple times to use different skis but it's tedious with so many screws. Did the switch on the workbench at home; it's not something I'd plan to do on the tailgate at trailhead. Easy enough I guess but why risk dropping screws in snow.

Really glad I did the QKs, even if I were not switching a binding ski to ski. The NTN Freedom's ski brake fits into slots at the base of the binding and can only be removed/serviced by removing the binding. This summer I replaced the wide brakes on a couple pairs with the Freedom narrow brakes and I was glad I'd mounted the binding in a way that makes it easy to remove for repair / replace.

Haydos
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon May 15, 2017 8:01 am

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby Haydos » Sun Sep 03, 2017 2:04 am

Thanks Teleclub!

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dnt_upton
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Location: Drink Moxie

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby dnt_upton » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:48 am

The main problem with QK's (or Binding Freedom inserts, my personal preference) paired with Bishops is the amount of time to move both bindings between skis. If it were me and if I were planning to swap back and forth regularly, I'd buy the switch kit for $70. QKs alone will run $25 (assuming you install them yourself). I should note that I have experience only with the older binding. Maybe these install quicker, but it doesn't look that way. You mount the bracket and then mount the binding to the bracket.

And to be clear, inserts are awesome. I use them all the time and install them for friends - probably 10 pairs of skis per winter. But they work great when you can swap bindings in under 5-10 minutes. Some bindings are a PITA to swap (22D Axl, Vice - aligning that slick pin through the holes and base plate) and some take a lot of time because of the number of screws to remove (Bishop). Voile and HH are easy.

telemarkmark
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat May 10, 2014 11:15 am

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby telemarkmark » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:51 am

On a narrow / light ski (ie Skimo ski) you are removing a substantial amount of width from the structure. 13mm of 65mm = 20%. Not sure if this is significant though.

Rodbelan
Posts: 209
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2014 9:53 am

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby Rodbelan » Tue Sep 05, 2017 11:01 am

telemarkmark wrote:On a narrow / light ski (ie Skimo ski) you are removing a substantial amount of width from the structure. 13mm of 65mm = 20%. Not sure if this is significant though.


Small round holes filled with stain steel & epoxy? Not significant. Never had any problem.

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dnt_upton
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Location: Drink Moxie

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby dnt_upton » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:03 am

What Rod said.

Harris
Posts: 128
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:08 pm

Re: Quiver Killers or 2nd Ski Kit?

Postby Harris » Tue Oct 03, 2017 6:04 pm

Like the other posters I've put in a fair amount of QKs on several skis at home, and have never had an issue. With the kits they supply the drill, tap and tool to install them.

Some advice on drilling: 1st off, A RULE with these, get ready to take your time. Hint: Drink your celebratory beers afterwards. You want really clean, straight holes that are drilled exactly to the right depth. The bottomming drill works pretty good as far as depth goes, but you can still go a little too deep. That isn't a problem exactly, but shoot for perfect by really watching the bit as it gets to the bottoming portion, blowing the drill shavings and dust away as you get close. You want to just nick the resin top plate of the ski. If you go a little high you can easily file them to the top plate. It happens. If you go a little low it just looks ugly. Skis with a metal sheet will keep you from really screwing up, but the bottoming portion of the bit will cut into resin and wood pretty easily. I'd also highly recommend using a template and center punching dead nuts (you can buy a center punch at any hardware store). This is especially true if you use any of the 22 Designs bindings, which have toe boxes that are sprung inward when disassembled. I do not use a template, but I'm an aircraft mechanic who worked sheet metal for years; I've located thousands of holes, but even still, without a template for my Vice and Axle bindings it took quite a bit of time using C-clamps and hook scribing, making sure I was perfect to get to the drilling phase. When drilling I start with a #40 bit; make sure you don't walk the hole. Because you binding screws are going into an insert rather than a ski's wood core you have less wiggle room for error. If you are not good at drilling don't try it! Take it to a good shop. Next I drill using a 3/16". Using tape, I tape my bits to set my depth. Shops probably use drill stops. Taping the bit works fine if you are careful. You also want to make sure you drill square, very square. After bottom drilling and again after tapping, clean out your holes using a toothpick. Drill shavings and dust will pack down and look like a clean bottom, but it won't be. Clean that crap out or the insert will bottom earlier than it should. When I screw in the inserts I use marine epoxy, using a toothpick to smear it around my holes. I only mix enough epoxy to do several holes at a time. DON"T FILL THE HOLES UP WITH EPOXY! Liquid lock will keep the insert from screwing all the way in. Even still, after a minute or so I go back and re-snug my inserts before the epoxy hardens. If you are doing multiple binding mounts on one ski, lay out the mount holes for all the bindings you intend to use before drilling a single hole, or you could run into an overlap issue that you might not have thought was going to be a problem. This was the case for mounting up for both VICE/AXEL bindings and Dynafits, which left very little wiggle room, in fact I ended up making my own base plate out of 1/4" 6061 for the Dynafits in order to circumnavigate the issue.

Lastly, I absolutely love my QKs, and regularly swap bindings between 3 sets of skis. Like one poster mentioned 22 Designs take a little time to swap, but once you do it a few times it is really pretty easy. I can swap in about 15 minutes and have done it on my tail gate.


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