Voile V6 compared to Vagabond - Mount Advice?

[voilenerd]

I got some Summit Cone Vagabonds and I am bit torn on skis compared to my Voiles. I will write up a review later after I get more time on them.

Axl bindings were mounted by factory however the mount seems a bit back from BC line on ski than what I am normally use to. It's about 10 or 15mm back from the Boot Sole Line on T2 boots depending on what angle I eyeball it.

After skiing the skis twice it does not feel I'm in the backseat but the skis are a bit stiffer in tip and tail than my V6 and harder/slower to initiate tele turn in steeper terrian while low angle terrain is not an issue. Will moving the binding up 10 or 15 mm and aligning with BSL and BC line on ski help with turns? I asked TD about this and said it's normal mount and they install 75mm a bit back from BC line.

My V6 were mounted boot sole center according to Voile specs and turn on a dime and kick and glide is fine and don't feel tip divy on downhill in deep snow. Maybe it's just the traits of new Vagabond ski and getting use to a slightly stiffer board? Another thing I noticed today was turning in trees I would have to slow down a bit more then normal before going into tele turn. On my V6s for the most part, I just drop the knee and they turn where ever I point them.

Any thoughts, thanks.

[voilenerd]

Removed

[Woodserson]

Wow, nice set up!!!

I don't know, this is always a tough one. I have V6 and they can spoil you rotten. I don't have or have skied anything else like it. A more forward mount on the other skis could help with turn initiation, but then it could cause other problems, maybe, especially since the tail is stiffer. I mounted my V6s a bit back from recommended...but not too much because of that soft skinny tail.

Give it some time, unlock the ski, (the different flex is key here in getting used to it) then decide.

[voilenerd]

Thanks Woods. Yeah I think I may need to give it more time before considering remount. Ive got too many skis, I think im done buying new skis for at least 4 years! I also got a set of Hyper vector bcs along with other skinnier nordic skis! The Vectors are not quite as stiff either in tip and tail as the Vagabond.

So far what really shines is how well the Vagabond tours. With the stiffer ski they track straighter on the flats then my other wide skis and kick and glide is alot more efficient while being less tiring after longer day.

The biggest improvement this year was stepping up to free pivot binding and very stiff adjustable binding. After first skiing the Axl I could barely get my boot to move in ski mode. It felt way too stiff! Moving the pin foward and then sking on them for a week really improved my skills. From what I hear the springs take some time to break in.

The stiffer binding makes pressuring the rear ski alot easier. Big step up from the Voile Hardwires and X2. Also love how easy the climbing pegs go up on Axl. My Voiles were sometimes a pain to get heel pegs up or even down. Free pivot also gives me less lower back pain after long day skiing and easier on legs, reminds me of my NNN BCs when kicking and gliding. 22 designs by far has the best 75mm and NTN bindings out there!

[Woodserson]

That's an interesting review of the Axls over the X2. What boot are you using?

I don't have any Axls, I have a pair of Vices I bought for a song but haven't mounted yet... I really like the moveable pivot and spring choices, I think that's pretty clutch.

[voilenerd]

Im running T2 Ecos the Blue and Acid green model. Fit is spot on and I can tour all day in them with no issues. I also got some brand new T1 bumblee bees I scored off Ebay. Waiting on some new Pro Tour liners for those because the stock ones are super heavy and dont feet my feet all that well. The T1 boots are same BSL as my T2s.

If you end up mounting the Vice and like it for your downhill skis I would jump on getting Axl for your wide touring skis.

[Andy M]

Interesting post. I have thought about trying out some Summit Cone skis, but they are all too close in dimensions and weight to other skis I already have. I am curious why you got the Vagabond when you already had the V6 BC, since they are so similar in dimensions. Not a critical comment, as I also have different skis that are very similar in dimensions -- just curious.

From your photo, the Vagabond mount does appear to be a bit to the tail of the ski, but I would assume that TD knows where to mount skis that they designed.

Regarding the Axl vs. Switchback X2, have you actually toured and skied with the X2? I have skied both the Axl and X2 for many years, and I like both bindings. Although I would give the Axl the edge on downhill ability, the X2 scores much better on tourability, weight and price. The tourability part alone would have me mounting it on a ski with scales (vs the Axl). I recently did a tour with some skis with Axl's, and they felt clunky compared to the X2's. Note: The X2 has about 60 degrees of range of motion in touring mode vs. about 45 degrees for the Axl -- I didn't realize this until after I got the Axl's.

So if you decide to remount the Vagabonds, you might consider the X2's, especially since you are "voilenerd"

[voilenerd]

Hey Andy, honestly just wanted to try another brand for skis.

As for the X2 yes Ive skied that and the regular Switchback, Hardwires, CRBs, and old cables. I did not noticed the additional range of motion of the X2 when touring and did experence icing to move the binding to ski mode several times. The X2 did feel lighter but other than that I dont see much advantage for tours. The advantage with the Axl is when I go hit steeper terrian I can adjust the stiffness like skiing the steep terrian around Cammeron Pass, Co or going down Medicine Bow Peak face. Im not sure how someone would reach a full 60 or even 45 degree range when touring besides up hill kick turns skinning up steep faces.

[BCSkier!]

I can say with some degree of certainty that the binding mount too far back is the issue of poor response/turn initiation. I have 160cm Voile Vector/Vector BC, Rossignol BC 125's x 165cm, and Altai Kom 162cm that all ski exceptionally well, but have certain strengths or slight characteristics variables. Many other Telemark skis, and virtually all have benefited from skiing more centered on the ski than sometimes recommended, or certainly old school pins on balance point etc.... I recommend finding ski "working center": That is the 1/2 way point between widest point at tip, and widest point of tail. This is boot center, or at least: ball of foot; thereby meaning telemark pin line is at least 1/3 boot sole length (pins to heel), to 1/2 boot AHEAD of boot/ski center. Mark my words!

[BCSkier!]

I will assume my comment will be approved.. so here is an accompanying photo of "center" mounted (or nearly, as in some were earlier and not fully committed)