just got my USSMA license yesterday. I am targeting all 5 USSMA skimo races in the East this year...and I'm going to do it on Tele gear. yes that means I need to buy boots, bindings and skis...a tele setup will never be as light as a pure skimo race AT setup, but I am going to see what I can put together. the biggest issue seems to be NTN tele boots with good ROM.
I'm at the tail end of my trail running race season, with only 2 more big races on the calendar, starting with 6hrs at Mad River Glenn next weekend.
I did my first skimo-oriented workout yesterday...and my glutes are sore today. this training is kind of the opposite of my normal 50k trail run training.
workout (inside version)
- 10 min treadmill job
- 15 mins at 12% incline at 4.5mph
- 3 sets of 10 double leg squats
- 3 sets of 10 single leg lunge
- 3 sets of 10 box single leg box step ups
- 15 mins flat jog
over the next couple of months I will expand this workout to last 90 mins, and alternate 25 mins at 12% incline with 5-10 mins of jump lunges, until I have completed 3 full sets.
thats the indoor workout goal. weekends I can spend time at the local ski resort running/climbing the ski trails
its a big transition from ultra trail running training where 90% is lower HR endurance training. skimo is much more concentrated efforts over shorter periods of time...
btw, I absolutely blame Whitefish last season for my new obsession with Skimo. I raced one time at the Whiteout, and thats all it took.
Skimo race training....for Tele
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chris_the_wrench
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:29 pm
Re: Skimo race training....for Tele
What are you using for your training reference? Uphill athlete? Also curious what resource your using for your 50k training?
Sorry no input on tele gear, but I do live in Whitefish!
-Chris
edit -- I tried that treadmill workout this morning and nearly went flying off the back of the machine at 10 minutes at the incline. Give's me something to work towards!
Sorry no input on tele gear, but I do live in Whitefish!
-Chris
edit -- I tried that treadmill workout this morning and nearly went flying off the back of the machine at 10 minutes at the incline. Give's me something to work towards!
Re: Skimo race training....for Tele
ah Whitefish! such a cool uphill community there !
I went old school with my 50k training plans. in the spring I downloaded a Hal Higdon 16 week plan. its based on something like 80% of running at roughly a MAF effort, which is roughly a HR of 180 - 50. so many of my miles are at an avg HR of 130. completing this plan over and over has enabled me to complete races that cover 5-7 hours, 10,000ft of vert, 50k distance etc. basically I spent most of this year building an aerobic base....because I did not have the last 10 years of exercise in my body...I had to start at the beginning. the 20% of my "training" that was not at a low PE was basically race time. I love racing, so I race as often as possible. the shortest I race is 10 miles, longest = 50k. I raced every weekend in august and September...I also spent the summer slogging through long races in 95 degrees and 90% humidity...those very tough days...
I've been able to build alot of leg strength running "beast coast" races on super gnarly courses like Jay Peak that cover stretches of the AT trail...boulders, rocks, roots that require big step up/downs, and downhill running.
BUT, running does not do a good job approximating the telemark ski motion where every turn is basically a deep knee lunge. running, even on trails, uses a limited range of motion and leg angle. so as I turn to Skimo race training, focus is on 2 things:
1. extending the range of leg motion, eg single leg lunges with knee to ground, box step ups etc
2. more V02max type workouts where the efforts are shorter( eg 15-20 mins) but are done at threshold. eg, approximating a fast skin-up a ski trail race scenario
the indoor workout of incline running followed by box step-ups, lunges etc is designed to be similar to a typical skimo race
I did buy the Uphill Athlete book a few weeks ago. I use it like a dictionary to reference different kinds of workouts, but you still have to assemble your own training plan.
when I did that indoor skimo workout for the first time the other day, it resulted in super sore glutei, groin and hamstrings ...so I know its working and is something I need to keep doing...I'm at a point now where running and races does not produce sore muscles, but that skimo workout sure does !
I went old school with my 50k training plans. in the spring I downloaded a Hal Higdon 16 week plan. its based on something like 80% of running at roughly a MAF effort, which is roughly a HR of 180 - 50. so many of my miles are at an avg HR of 130. completing this plan over and over has enabled me to complete races that cover 5-7 hours, 10,000ft of vert, 50k distance etc. basically I spent most of this year building an aerobic base....because I did not have the last 10 years of exercise in my body...I had to start at the beginning. the 20% of my "training" that was not at a low PE was basically race time. I love racing, so I race as often as possible. the shortest I race is 10 miles, longest = 50k. I raced every weekend in august and September...I also spent the summer slogging through long races in 95 degrees and 90% humidity...those very tough days...
I've been able to build alot of leg strength running "beast coast" races on super gnarly courses like Jay Peak that cover stretches of the AT trail...boulders, rocks, roots that require big step up/downs, and downhill running.
BUT, running does not do a good job approximating the telemark ski motion where every turn is basically a deep knee lunge. running, even on trails, uses a limited range of motion and leg angle. so as I turn to Skimo race training, focus is on 2 things:
1. extending the range of leg motion, eg single leg lunges with knee to ground, box step ups etc
2. more V02max type workouts where the efforts are shorter( eg 15-20 mins) but are done at threshold. eg, approximating a fast skin-up a ski trail race scenario
the indoor workout of incline running followed by box step-ups, lunges etc is designed to be similar to a typical skimo race
I did buy the Uphill Athlete book a few weeks ago. I use it like a dictionary to reference different kinds of workouts, but you still have to assemble your own training plan.
when I did that indoor skimo workout for the first time the other day, it resulted in super sore glutei, groin and hamstrings ...so I know its working and is something I need to keep doing...I'm at a point now where running and races does not produce sore muscles, but that skimo workout sure does !
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fgd135
- Posts: 470
- Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2020 2:55 pm
- Location: Colorado
- Ski style: Yes, sometimes.
- Favorite Skis: Most of them
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- Occupation: Yes
Re: Skimo race training....for Tele
It's great they'll allow tele gear in that racing circuit, quite the anathema for those folks that can't imagine going downhill without locked heels.
When I lived in Summit County, we trained for mountaineering and skiing by first walking, then running, up the summer slopes of the local ski areas, Breck, Copper, Abasin.
Good luck!
When I lived in Summit County, we trained for mountaineering and skiing by first walking, then running, up the summer slopes of the local ski areas, Breck, Copper, Abasin.
Good luck!
"To me, gracefulness on skis should be the end-all of the sport" --Stein Eriksen
Re: Skimo race training....for Tele
I won the overall in the 6hr race at Mad River Glenn. I guess the training is working. this is the first race this year that I have managed to win the overall race. the course was about 2.5 miles from base to summit, covering about 2500ft of vert, so about 1000ft per mile, so about 20% avg grade, which is pretty steep in a running race. each ascent took about 55 mins. my avg ascent pace was 88% of my max HR( 155 out of 175), so I was pleased I could hold 88% for about an hour per loop. I had hoped to get more loops completed, but the downhill was on a super muddy ski trail and I just couldn't manage a faster downhill pace. I do think that running downhill is easier than skiing Tele downhill because the ROM when running doesn't crush your quads quite as much as a deep knee bend tele turn. I still have alot of work to do to improve my muscle endurance in a full ROM tele turn.
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chris_the_wrench
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:29 pm
Re: Skimo race training....for Tele
@bauerb
Congrats!!
Each uphill took you 55 minutes, how long did the downhills take? And how many laps did you knock out? Thats alot of vert!
Congrats!!
Each uphill took you 55 minutes, how long did the downhills take? And how many laps did you knock out? Thats alot of vert!
Re: Skimo race training....for Tele
did a 3hr endurance run at the local ski resort on Saturday, easy/medium effort on each climb, about 3500ft of vert over 11 miles and 4 laps.
Sunday I thought it would be a good idea to do some V02max sprints. so after a 20 min warmup I found a 20% grade slope around mid-mountain and started a set of 10 x 1 min. it was a disaster. my HR never got above 155 despite me slobbering and panting like a dog.
I was using poles and my max effort only enabled me to run about 30 secs with speed hike/pole for 30 secs. I know I have a Diesel engine and not a high revving engine, but still thought I'd closer to max HR in 1 min.
the only good news is that on each walk down the hill my HR recovered consistently from 155 to about 95. I think these efforts are too short for me to reach max HR( closer to 175). I think that when I do these again I will target 6-8 min efforts....granted all my training this year has been for 50k trail races, so maybe it just takes me a lot longer to get a max HR. for me, 155 is something I can maintain for an hour...
Sunday I thought it would be a good idea to do some V02max sprints. so after a 20 min warmup I found a 20% grade slope around mid-mountain and started a set of 10 x 1 min. it was a disaster. my HR never got above 155 despite me slobbering and panting like a dog.
I was using poles and my max effort only enabled me to run about 30 secs with speed hike/pole for 30 secs. I know I have a Diesel engine and not a high revving engine, but still thought I'd closer to max HR in 1 min.
the only good news is that on each walk down the hill my HR recovered consistently from 155 to about 95. I think these efforts are too short for me to reach max HR( closer to 175). I think that when I do these again I will target 6-8 min efforts....granted all my training this year has been for 50k trail races, so maybe it just takes me a lot longer to get a max HR. for me, 155 is something I can maintain for an hour...