NTN Binding Debate 5.0

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BrowsieLover
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NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by BrowsieLover » Wed Oct 23, 2019 9:49 am

Can we RESURRECT the binding topic? I have been lurking this site for a bit and it seems this has not gotten a good run-through since 2017. A lot has changed, and since I'm about to pull the trigger on some new binders, I'd love to hear some refreshed thoughts!
Me? I've been making tele turns since 92. When NTN came out, I bought all new gear and have been skiing NTN since 09. I've broken everything there is to break (boots, bindings, torn bindings out of skis, etc).
I've gone through 3 pairs of Freerides and ONE pair of Freedoms (which literally seemed to disintegrate under foot while on a 12" bluebird morning at A-Basin). My current freerides have repaired (welded) toe cups and have worked now for a couple seasons without issues, but I just got some new skis and there is no way in hell I'm going to put old welded binders on new skis...
I particularly LIKE how the Rotte skis, but then again, I've got about 9 years getting used to them. At this point, however, It would be very hard for anyone to convince me to buy another pair. I've not gotten any warranty benefits out of that company, so time to move on, but I'd like something that has a comparable feel.
From a numbers perspective, I'd expect to hear more people directing me to the Outlaw X. It seems to be a very safe recommendation and I be willing to bet it's holding on to at least half of the NTN marketplace. It seems like it's reliable and it also seems to be a good value at $399.
I'd love to hear from someone who has time on the BMF-3. Just from a design perspective, it LOOKS like it would yield a very torsionally rigid power transfer (which I believe I get out of the Freerides).
Thoughts? Thanks in advance!

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Johnny
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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by Johnny » Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:36 am

I have owned every NTN boots... Several pairs of Prophets, Terminators, Old comps, new comps, old WCs, new WCs, Evos etc... Even the new NTN Scott Voodoos... They are all nice boots, but nothing beats the TX COMP... (Which is also the most expensive, I know... 8-) )

As for bindings, it's ok to want to look elsewhere. It's human nature. It's human nature to think it's better elsewhere. It's human nature to dig thru webpages written in a foreign langague trying to import some rare and exotic bindings from another world. I have no problem with that. Go on, try them all. Read all the crap written by crappy skiers on Facebook. Buy the hype. Spend your money on the hype and turn your whole quiver into swiss cheese. But just for fun, grab a pair of new Freerides. Not a 10yo beaten-up and cracked 2.0 pair with your old TXs. A brand new one with tight cups, tight cables and finely tuned new tubes, with a new pair of boots with new duckbutts. Try them once again and feel the magic... These Rottefella guys, they have been making bindings for 92 years. They basically invented telemark. Who do you trust? Think again and see for yourself... ;)
/...\ Peace, Love, Telemark and Tofu /...\
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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by Puls » Thu Oct 24, 2019 9:10 pm

I am there too BrowsieLover, need to buy new gear but discussions are quite old so I am looking for insight from people that have skied the latest version of the popular bindings last season...

I have been tele skiing for 12 years on 7tm but I need new skis and even if I love these bindings, it is time to switch to NTN...I was almost ready to buy the whole set ski+bindings+shoe but that is pretty steep so I am having second thoughts.
I did buy the skis already though.

My hesitation is because of the Bishop BMF. I could just buy these bindings and keep my 75mm shoes for a couple more seasons and then buy NTN shoes and change the toes parts on the BMF.

So now to add something to this topic instead of just basically doing a +1,I demoed the Meidjo 2.1 last season and loved them, especially the fact that like my old trusted 7tm, they do release even if there are not DIN certified.
They also have the tech-toe pins compatibility which is a plus for touring. I found them stiff but not too much and lateral guiding was incomparable to my 7tm.
Lynx, BMF, Outlaw, Freeride / Freedom just don't release or at least have not been specifically designed to release. Then only Lynx has the tech-toe pins but why get Lynx when I can get potential release with the Meidjo...

So I guess I am down to:

Meidjo 2.1 + TX Pro NTN ($$$)
BMF + my old 75mm boots ($ but heavy for touring and no release)

Any advice?

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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by Johnny » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:57 am

Keep in mind that while the BMF is a beautiful piece of engineering and work of art, it is not a true NTN binding. It's more like a traditional cable binding that can accommodate NTN boots. While it's a killer binding, you will not get the true second-heel NTN feeling out of it.

And most important, also keep in mind that the Freeride is the only binding on the market with an adjustable mounting plate. With all the complex camber, rocker, flex and sidecut profiles on modern skis, it is an absolute must to be able to adjust the position after drilling. For me, this is the most important factor for maximum performance and maximum fun before turning your new 1000$ exotic skis into a swiss cheese... A mandatory feature you will not get even from a 600$ Meidjo...

(I know, as I said, people want something new in their lives, they are willing to spend big bucks on any gear as long as it's new and different... I totally understand that... So feel free to simply ignore everything I say... 8-) )
/...\ Peace, Love, Telemark and Tofu /...\
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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by TomH » Tue Oct 29, 2019 1:29 pm

I dunno, I've been on the black freerides since their inception (5/6 years...), and have yet to break them, and I'm not a small guy (~200 lbs), nor am I particularly easy on equipment. I think the black frames fixed a lot of the old problems, particularly the frame being beveled up on the rear, which minimizes the stress on the frame from the ski flexing up on it, and the toe cups land a little differently on the frame as well. The only issue I have is a partially stripped screw on one of the bindings that locks it to the plate (but it's been that way for ~3 years now with no ill effect). They get a bad rap, but for an in-area binding, I really like them. My only want would be brakes that actually pull in like alpine bindings.

I swapped skis with a guy that had Outlaw X's last year, and they were nice too. I thought they felt a bit more like my old HH's and seemed a little less precise on edge pressure, but I think that was more attributable to his ski/binding combo and the location of the binding mount (way too far forward imo). I'm sure I'd get used to it, but getting in/out of the binding seemed more finicky to me, and being a patroller, I'm in and out of them often.

With all that being said, I think a lot of freeride toe cup failures probably come about from repeatedly bottoming out the binding, which I don't do often. If you're a low skier, I think the Outlaw X has more travel.

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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by MSU Alum » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:04 am

I feel your pain. The good news is that replacement toe pieces for Freedoms is now about $8.

I've been on G3's, 7TM's, Hammerheads, Axles, Freerides and most recently Freedoms for several years. In addition to breaking Freedom toe pieces (lots of bump days!) the bindings have trashed the tops of my Scarpa Tx Comps!

I'm going with a low tech toe option this year.

My son recently got the Meidjo 2.1 with Cripsi Evo boot and can't say enough good things about the combo. I pulled the trigger on the Crispi Evo's and am going to transition to the Meidjo as well, but there are other options such as the 22 designs Lynx, which is cheaper.

The Crispi does have the rear tech fitting as well. Most people have no need for this, but if you are a patroller and have to drag a sled, or, if you are doing something more expeditionary (not a factor for me) there is a Meidjo Alpine heel fitting that works with the Meidjo binding to hold the heel down. I'm not interested, but some may be so I thought I'd mention it.

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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by BrowsieLover » Fri Nov 01, 2019 2:48 pm

Hey Gang - OP here.
I mentioned that Scarpa (Rottefella NA distribution) would not sell me a single binding after my last breakage, but they DID step up with a deal which made it economically attractive to stick with Freerides. After all, I really like how they ski, and though the call of the "NEW" was distracting, Johnny made a good point earlier and I'm very happy that SCARPA NA customer service also helped me in my decision making process.
Now, we just need some more SNOW!
Cheers!

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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by voilenerd » Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:00 pm

Voile just released a tech binding for their split boards. Maybe they have a tele tech binding system in the R&D process for thier skis?

75mm with free pivot just plan works great for me. Never tried NTN, maybe in another 3 or 5 years I might.

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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by MSU Alum » Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:11 am

voilenerd wrote:
Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:00 pm
75mm with free pivot just plan works great for me. Never tried NTN, maybe in another 3 or 5 years I might.
If you don't spend much time inbounds, I don't see much point in going the NTN route. It's pretty pricey to get the boots, bindings and likely new skis (the mount pattern would probably be a problem). I was on T2 Ecos and Axl's for a while and I thought it was a great combo!

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Re: NTN Binding Debate 5.0

Post by Jump » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:24 pm

Hello all - new to this board. please explain "lateral guiding was incomparable to my 7tm". I have been 3 pin from the 70s, got 7tm in 2005. Looking to making the move to NTN. The Meidjo 2.1 looks best. Does the above term imply that NTN offers better control then the 7TM? Thanks

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