The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

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GuillaumeM
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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by GuillaumeM » Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:10 pm

bgregoire wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:05 pm
GuillaumeM wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:42 am
Gamme stated that the boot is more important than the binding for DH control and I still believe it is true, especially sole stiffness. What about an Alpina Alaska with a kind of articulated/removable collar for additional stiffness on steep DH?
I think that is true but only to a certain extent (everything is relative!). On a NNN-BC system, you can only stiffen the boot up to the point where the limitations of the binding itself is reached. Long ago, Alpina (and other such as Alico) came up with uber stiff NNN-BC compatible boots. They did not last in the market and I believe its because they could not deliver what their 3-pin equivalents did with a cable binding.
It seems that boots on BC have reached a good sole stiffness with the Alaska. On my Stetind I am also quite pleased with the sole stiffness and my main concern is ankle support on steep hard pack where I can get very tired on long inclined traverse and wide skis. Not convinced I would gain anything with the new Xplore on that side, would rather have an Alaskisen/Svartaska BC. :D

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Johnny
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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by Johnny » Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:11 am

montrealer wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 11:37 am
Is there any snow left to test whatever may be in that box??
Yessss! 8-)

_IMG_0168.jpg
Rodbelan wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:41 pm
Yeah... What's in the box?
They call it the Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding System... Also, there was boots and skis in there... 8-)

fisheater wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 4:20 pm
Your enthusiasm could start a serious GAS Pandemic.
I know it seems hard to believe, but I try very hard to hide my enthusiasm the best I can when I review gear. But as you learned, this is something pretty hard for me. I have no interest in cheap and bad gear, I only review exceptional gear that I feel the world should really know about. So it's pretty hard not to be over-enthusiastic with all the great stuff out there. But I promise, I will try harder to be as neutral as possible, and not let my ecstatic emotions take control of my writing in the future.... 8-)

Nitram Tocrut wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 9:33 pm
Maybe you have some surprises from Åsnes? Maybe some of their wider skis with scales? It’s not in their new catalog but maybe they were holding the announcement for a TelemarkTalk exclusivity?
Nope. They will NOT develop wider skis with scales. They don't believe that this is the future, and this is what a lot of people want. They did several tests with wider skis and according to them, they just don't work. Very, very sad.

spopepro wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:02 am
I’d settle for “as good as 3-pin with cables” without having to mess with cables.
This is already available, it's called NNN-BC... 8-)

bgregoire wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:05 pm
Long ago, Alpina (and other such as Alico) came up with uber stiff NNN-BC compatible boots. They did not last in the market and I believe its because they could not deliver what their 3-pin equivalents did with a cable binding.
Wrong. They did not last because people were too stupid to understand how to ski them. And still today in 2021, this is also the same reason why people are still using pins and cables instead of NNN-BC... They just don't understand how to use it and how to ski it.

GuillaumeM wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:42 am
What about an Alpina Alaska with a kind of articulated/removable collar for additional stiffness on steep DH? Rottefella could also have modernised the BC system by adding a kind of elastic band/cable attached to the heel? There are probably many solutions out there, we do not need to make a copy of an AT binding just because it is trendy, even if I understand the potential business back it.
Precisely. There are PLENTY of solutions and brilliant ideas everywhere. Most of them never see the light of day. The finest artists on the planet are totally unknown. The most brilliant movies will never be seen by anyone. The most amazing books of the entire human history will never be read by anyone. Who's fault? Hint: it's not businesses, they never act blindly, everything is calculated... They spend big bucks in focus groups and research to give the people exactly what they ask for.
/...\ Peace, Love, Telemark and Tofu /...\
"And if you like to risk your neck, we'll boom down Sutton in old Quebec..."





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Shenanagains
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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by Shenanagains » Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:39 pm

Johnny, it is SO discouraging to hear there will be no fish scale Asnes models wider than available now. Are Voile skis not available in Norway??? Or does the Asnes crew just think, they can't compete with Voile's models? Like, something narrower than an Objective but still downhill capable... and able to hold Telemark bindings? And with a pattern that offers more glide and a bit less grip?

As for whether they work, I can say for sure: my MOST USED skis are Vector BC's and my second most used pair are FT 68's I cut a pattern base into. They most definitely do work, and are different enough that both are useful.


On a similar note, it so far looks as if the new Rottefella system will not include boots more supportive than the current NNN-BC offerings. Also VERY discouraging.


It really, really seems there should be a Norwegian joke for these almost good ideas.





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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by Musk Ox » Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:38 pm

Shenanagains wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:39 pm
Are Voile skis not available in Norway???
No. Never seen a single pair for sale here, fwiw





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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by YakovL » Tue Apr 13, 2021 7:12 pm

Hi,

I really glad to known that Rottefella is looking for new solutions in ski bindings and really hears our needs in general. The first photo and short specification of the EXPLORE system was promising as for me. But then I fall in doubdtfull.

The springed pins integrated in the boot's sole might be a bad idea because it is a closed system. Is it possible to use that device in really cold and wet conditions?

For examples:

- Temperature from -20 to -40 C (from -4 to -40 F) and powdery frozen snow (small like dentifrice). Snow like this blocked our NNN BC bindings (automaric usually but also manual) many times. What happened if this snow put into the pins?

- The same temperature and water. We have to walk (both on ski and with no ski) accross frozen river and falling in water on the ice in really cold weather (low to -40C (-40F)). If you immediately open your NNN BC bindings and push water and ice out you can safe your bindings from block but if no - you can get free your boots only in warm room or with bonfire or burner. I afraid the new Explore system springed pins I couldn't clear from ice and water anyway.





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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by telerat » Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:22 am

I'm also curious if the integrated pins will freeze, but if not it looks to be a very simple and robust system.

The design of the boots looks like it may easily be adapted for use in a light tech binding, but it would still require a tech binding with a flex plate and boot manufacturers commitment. I think that will be tough to do with Xplore just released. Such a binding can also freeze and would possibly be more complicated than the Xplore system, but may also allow easier cleaning/fixing in the field. It's easier to bring a shoe inside to unfreeze than skies though.

I talked to a local seller last week that had tried Xplore, and he was very positive. He said that the boots would be stiffened up before launch, so I'm hopeful that will improve the performance and make me happy with them.





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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by Åsnes1922 » Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:38 am

lilcliffy wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:46 pm
Well! Finally got a chance to read those UTE Magazine reviews of the Xplore binding and Free boot-
Not impressed.
Perhaps Crister is receiving fresh update test models as they work on it and Rottefella has increased the resistance of the standard flexor?
Binding resistance is VERY important- not only for downhill skiing- but also for kick and glide IMO.
The Xplore binding has got to be as good as my 75mm-3pin touring setups for me to even to consider it...
For now I am happy with both NNNBC and NN-75mm- I will wait for more testing and reviews over the next couple of seasons!
So to clearify for everyone:

Pål Trygve Gamme recieved one of the first editions of the binding and boots, so A LOT has happened since then. I'm not really sure why Rottefella sent it to him at all, cause he can be a bit rough and biased in his reviews sometimes. In my optinon.

What really puzzles me, is why this review got published at all, as the binding and boots used in the "test" were not even close to the models we have been testing after new years.

I too got a binding with a non-functional flex the first time around, but we quickly got new parts, new boots and new bindings. And I can ensure there was a HUGE difference. It'n not long ago I gave my last feedback, reports and discussed with both ALFA and Rottefella. They have gotten a lot of written feedback and reports from some serious testers, including us at Åsnes, Aleksander Gamme and many others. All of us positve after they have listened to our reports and all the way improved the system. So this review in Utemagasinet kind of puzzles me, as it is in no way representive of the feedback from hundreds of shops, testers and developers included in this project.

In my opinion, this review should have never been published. But hey, I guess he just reviewed what he got and did'nt think of all the work done afterwords. None of the involved parties were ever consulted about the review in Utemagasinet either.
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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by riel » Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:31 pm

Åsnes1922 wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:38 am
Pål Trygve Gamme recieved one of the first editions of the binding and boots, so A LOT has happened since then. I'm not really sure why Rottefella sent it to him at all, cause he can be a bit rough and biased in his reviews sometimes. In my optinon.

What really puzzles me, is why this review got published at all, as the binding and boots used in the "test" were not even close to the models we have been testing after new years.

I too got a binding with a non-functional flex the first time around, but we quickly got new parts, new boots and new bindings. And I can ensure there was a HUGE difference. It'n not long ago I gave my last feedback, reports and discussed with both ALFA and Rottefella. They have gotten a lot of written feedback and reports from some serious testers, including us at Åsnes, Aleksander Gamme and many others. All of us positve after they have listened to our reports and all the way improved the system. So this review in Utemagasinet kind of puzzles me, as it is in no way representive of the feedback from hundreds of shops, testers and developers included in this project.
Ohhh, now I feel like trying out Xplore gear again. Too bad the snow is gone, and there's no Xplore gear on this side of the Atlantic as far as I know :)

I'm still hoping for something stiffer than a Fischer BCX6(75) or Alpina Alaska on bindings that are only attached in the front :)





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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by bgregoire » Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:35 pm

Åsnes1922 wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:38 am
So to clearify for everyone:
Thanks for clarifying Crister.
I live for the Telemark arc....The feeeeeeel.....I ski miles to get to a place where there is guaranteed snow to do the deal....TM





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Re: The new Rottefella XPLORE OFFTRACK Binding system

Post by Rodbelan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:02 pm

Åsnes1922 wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:38 am
lilcliffy wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:46 pm
Well! Finally got a chance to read those UTE Magazine reviews of the Xplore binding and Free boot-
Not impressed.
Perhaps Crister is receiving fresh update test models as they work on it and Rottefella has increased the resistance of the standard flexor?
Binding resistance is VERY important- not only for downhill skiing- but also for kick and glide IMO.
The Xplore binding has got to be as good as my 75mm-3pin touring setups for me to even to consider it...
For now I am happy with both NNNBC and NN-75mm- I will wait for more testing and reviews over the next couple of seasons!
So to clearify for everyone:

Pål Trygve Gamme recieved one of the first editions of the binding and boots, so A LOT has happened since then. I'm not really sure why Rottefella sent it to him at all, cause he can be a bit rough and biased in his reviews sometimes. In my optinon.

What really puzzles me, is why this review got published at all, as the binding and boots used in the "test" were not even close to the models we have been testing after new years.

I too got a binding with a non-functional flex the first time around, but we quickly got new parts, new boots and new bindings. And I can ensure there was a HUGE difference. It'n not long ago I gave my last feedback, reports and discussed with both ALFA and Rottefella. They have gotten a lot of written feedback and reports from some serious testers, including us at Åsnes, Aleksander Gamme and many others. All of us positve after they have listened to our reports and all the way improved the system. So this review in Utemagasinet kind of puzzles me, as it is in no way representive of the feedback from hundreds of shops, testers and developers included in this project.

In my opinion, this review should have never been published. But hey, I guess he just reviewed what he got and did'nt think of all the work done afterwords. None of the involved parties were ever consulted about the review in Utemagasinet either.
In my book, there is noting wrong with Pål Trygve criticizing the system... Of course it goes against the big marketing machine... Know what? I prefer Pål Trygve to that big freaking merchandising bulldozer.

Not saying that the Explore is bad. It seems, on the contrary, promising... But if someone criticizes it, it should be received as an opportunity to improve the bébelle. I am a bit perplex about that «shut up» reaction....
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