Falketind 62 X with Scales

[Transplantskier]

Not cheap and only sold in skimo lengths, but I'm really curious about this new offering from Voile. Scales on a legit lightweight ski.
https://www.voile.com/sr61-bc-skis.html

[jstewse]

I've been eyeing that new scaled Voile skimo ski as well, wondering if it could be a good match for an Xplore boot/binding.

[wabene]

If you are about 5'4" and 115lbs.

[JohnSKepler]

What would work better for backcountry use, scales or an inset skin like the Asnes MR48?

Would it be possible, I don’t really know how skis are constructed, to route out a channel in the ptex about 1/8” deep or so and maybe 30mm wide, basically the thickness of the base. Wouldn’t want to affect the flex properties of the ski. Then, ‘permanently’ afix a skin into the channel. Barge cement would probably do well.

I’m not against wax or half-skins but I’m coming to appreciate the extreme variability of conditions in Cache Valley. Not just from day to day but along a trail in a single 1-hour outing! Everything is in canyons around here, almost universally up hill. But there is huge variability in steepness and, because of the elevation, temperature variation, topography, vegetation, sunlight, and snowfall, you can go from slush to ice to powder to compacted, back to slush, ice, compacted, powder, ice, etc., in a mile! Neither skins nor wax are really appropriate.

[Stephen]

What would work better for backcountry use, scales or an inset skin like the Asnes MR48?

Gotta think it’s traction patter, with some option for skins, when that doesn’t work.
My limited experience with MR48 Skin is not liking the herky jerky grab / release when gliding.

Just guessing true track skis, with skins, that are carefully matched to the skier are not bad.

I remember being pretty happy with waxing in the mountains of Colorado in the 70s, but maybe the climate has changed enough since then that waxing is not as easy as it then was, unless one lives in a location with stable snow conditions for much of the winter.

As much as I like wax, when it works, people like @Tom M have taken the practical approach with no-wax skis, and skins for backup, or planned steeper climbs.

[fisheater]

John, boots are tough to come by. I’m going to be much more blunt than I have been. The best XCD scales out there in my opinion suck! Yes, I’m talking about Fischer scales. In eastern conditions, I can outclimb Fischer skins with wax or klister, and it’s nothing to brag about. My waxing also outglides Fischer scales.
Okay, now onto your western issues. You are skiing uphill, to ski downhill, in mountains and the temperature change is killing you. I would try the Voile Objective/Endeavor. The trouble is the boot. I bought an F-1 Race last year. It’s far lighter than my T-4, and paired with the Voile Transit it’s in a completely different league than my T-4/3-pin Hardwire.
I tour for turns in leather and a Falketind Xplore. My graphic relief doesn’t exceed 300 vertical feet. Fortunately for me, it can drop off steeply. Your graphic relief, is much larger and creates temperature micro climes. If I owned a T-4, I might buy an Endeavor, mount it Switchback, try to find an F-1 in my size, or suck it up and buy the new Scarpa TXP next year and re drill for a Voile Transit.
I might be nuts, but in a lighter ski, like my Falketind X, I can’t believe I can’t have much better touring for turns with wax, klister, and X-Skin, than you can with a S-bound. I had an S-112, and the first gen FT made me never want to ski another S-bound.
I know guys like them. I can’t wrap my head around it.

[JohnSKepler]

John, boots are tough to come by. I’m going to be much more blunt than I have been. The best XCD scales out there in my opinion suck! Yes, I’m talking about Fischer scales. In eastern conditions, I can outclimb Fischer skins with wax or klister, and it’s nothing to brag about. My waxing also outglides Fischer scales.
Okay, now onto your western issues. You are skiing uphill, to ski downhill, in mountains and the temperature change is killing you. I would try the Voile Objective/Endeavor. The trouble is the boot. I bought an F-1 Race last year. It’s far lighter than my T-4, and paired with the Voile Transit it’s in a completely different league than my T-4/3-pin Hardwire.
I tour for turns in leather and a Falketind Xplore. My graphic relief doesn’t exceed 300 vertical feet. Fortunately for me, it can drop off steeply. Your graphic relief, is much larger and creates temperature micro climes. If I owned a T-4, I might buy an Endeavor, mount it Switchback, try to find an F-1 in my size, or suck it up and buy the new Scarpa TXP next year and re drill for a Voile Transit.
I might be nuts, but in a lighter ski, like my Falketind X, I can’t believe I can’t have much better touring for turns with wax, klister, and X-Skin, than you can with a S-bound. I had an S-112, and the first gen FT made me never want to ski another S-bound.
I know guys like them. I can’t wrap my head around it.

I love the way my FT62 skis. It's probably my favorite ski. And last year I found a pair of Voile Objective on sale at the season end and snatched them up. In a lot of cases where I would prefer the FT I go with the Objective for the scales.

The real issue for me, and I'm addressing @Stephen's comment as well, is that where I live isn't very high. My home is at 4,500 ft. The canyons where I do 90% of my skiing are maybe 5,000 ft. My elevation change can be less than 500 feet in a typical trip. These canyons are more like ravines. Very, very steep walls and either heavily treed or rocks. The canyon skiing is mostly in the bottom along the roads. Sure, higher stuff is available and I do take advantage of it, but I really only have time for that maybe twice a month since it is an hour or more away. Even then we're looking at more like, 7,500 or 8,000 feet unless I want to drive several hours.

At these altitudes and latitude the day-to-day and during-a-tour variation in conditions is just huge. Sure, there's nothing better than wax for grip and speed but I'd be applying and scraping klister every day, sometimes a few times a day. The scales, on the other hand, just work. And when I'm going out at lunch or after work my time is super-limited.

We all got spoiled last year when it just wouldn't stop snowing. It'd be 35 degrees and snowing for days at a time. This year it's 33 degrees and raining for days at a time. It's not global warming or CO2. It's just where the atmospheric river is coming from. Last year in a Nino/Nina transition the rivers came from the north. This year they're coming more from the south. As a result, conditions are all over the place. Because I'm an engineer my mind always...

This explains it best

[phoenix]

"Would it be possible, I don’t really know how skis are constructed, to route out a channel in the ptex about 1/8” deep or so and maybe 30mm wide, basically the thickness of the base. Wouldn’t want to affect the flex properties of the ski. Then, ‘permanently’ afix a skin into the channel. Barge cement would probably do well."

It's been done before! I remember working on xc skis like that in the mid 80's, and they were nearing extinction at that time. Think they were Trak's; two sets, one on either side of the groove, about 15mm wide, ran the length of the kick zone. Used to clean out the original (mohair) stris when they got worn, and glue in new ones.
There have been a few other similar attempts over the years, but none have lasted long. Although, there are currently the Altai Hoks, which do have a following.

[JohnSKepler]

"Would it be possible, I don’t really know how skis are constructed, to route out a channel in the ptex about 1/8” deep or so and maybe 30mm wide, basically the thickness of the base. Wouldn’t want to affect the flex properties of the ski. Then, ‘permanently’ afix a skin into the channel. Barge cement would probably do well."

It's been done before! I remember working on xc skis like that in the mid 80's, and they were nearing extinction at that time. Think they were Trak's; two sets, one on either side of the groove, about 15mm wide, ran the length of the kick zone. Used to clean out the original (mohair) stris when they got worn, and glue in new ones.
There have been a few other similar attempts over the years, but none have lasted long. Although, there are currently the Altai Hoks, which do have a following.

They are definitely around. The Asnes MR48 Waxless gets good reivews. But all these are manufactured that way. I don't know if what I suggest is a good idea after the fact.

[fisheater]

@JohnSKepler
I think skins are closer to 1/16”. I know how I would router the base on an FT X, if conditions were driving me crazy.

I think it would be doable and better than scales. It isn’t often you western guys make me happy to be in SE MI.

Fishing season makes me happy to be in Michigan !