Telemark Technique

[CwmRaider]

It's really interesting from a social observation viewpoint how closed and cliquey this community is for something that considers itself "dying". Like, why do that?

Examples of this please.

[Lhartley]

Literally the comment I quoted. One forum that's hardly public talking about what's going on in another forum with sarcasm etc

[Lhartley]

OK, it's not a "closed" forum. Had a look and I get where they're coming from. My statement that it's a fragmented community is cemented by the dynamic of the three forums, and various commercial vibing

[Sidney Dunkin]

Manney wrote:

“It’s a site in which most members here and on BCT are critiqued by a bunch of old, mostly-banned geezers who are struggling with flare ups of erectile dysfunction, herpes, and gonorrhoea. A few cheerleaders from there are on this forum. Some under different sigs… some stupidly not.

It’s fun to read because half truths and old animosities combine to assuage their pain. Every so often the squad talks about the medical problems keeping them from shredding. LOL. Yeah… like that’s what kept them away from the WC circuit. Tough break.”

I had a look at it. Lotsa sarcasm, judgment, and negativity (wouldn’t be surprised if what I post here gets torn apart and I’m judged as a shitty wannabe skier too).

One of the best posts I’ve seen regarding skiing was contributed by FrenchFred…

“If it’s not fun, you’re not doing it right”

Absolutely!!!

But the geezers have a hard time reconciling fun, especially when someone’s interpretation of it falls outside “75mm”, “plastic”, “chair lifts”, etc.

Geezer thinking is very narrow. The gear stays the same and the level of aspiration shrinks to meet the medical condition/physical decline. So it becomes very regressive, until it disappears from view. This isn’t a function of old age… there are plenty of older former hard chargers who cheer on the next gen without imposing generational limits on their skiing. It’s a way of thinking about the sport.

It explains the arc of tele’s popularity.

If this happened in the DH world, snowboarding and freestyle would be shadows of what they are. Those niches and gear are very rich because geezers were bluntly told to get lost and shut up by people seeking their own fun.

This isn’t a unique view. It’s practically become a trope in ski circles.

https://www.backcountrytalk.com/forum/b ... post125888

In a sport that can take decades to become an expert, not listening to the old guys will surely hold you back. I also don't think old guys care what gear you ski. Most of them have skied it all and ski what they like.

[Manney]

Uh huh. So how does any of this explain the lack of gear progression, the decline of popularity?

This sport has become regressive for three reasons. First its practitioners became firmly ensconced in a time bubble. Second, they tried to drag everyone into it as they aged. Third, the sport changed to accommodate the aging bodies in it. Nobody earns turns any more. They ride the lifts, which is why the sport is nothing more than a turn with AT gear for many ppl.

It’s become a parody. And it gets worse…

Most stories you read talk about skiers coming back to the sport after decades away from it. It doesn’t take long for these people to cite age as a qualifier of experience. Ha ha. Ok, boomer.

[Sidney Dunkin]

Lack of gear progression? Who needs it? There is already enough gear available that is suited for everything from the golf course to extreme terrain, and it all works. Besides that, Voile just came out with a new binding. How much innovation has there been in alpine bindings lately?

The gear hasn't changed to accommodate aging bodies. Could you elaborate on this?

Everyone is not riding lifts, if they were there would be no need for Voiles new bc oriented binding.

You seem to have a problem with boomers, what's up with that?

[Manney]

My problem is with geezers who overrate their ability and presume to tell others what to do, what to use, what to aspire to. These are the tone deaf ones, which anyone knows who actually understands what the term “ok boomer” means. (It’s attitudinal.)

Skiing is athletics. Whatever level of athleticism ppl gained in their 20s isn’t improved by falling off bar stools at the union hall for decades before resuming the sport. There’s no sense arguing that point, so geezers move onto describing tele as “art” or some other nonsense when their claims of athletic excellence are questioned on a rational level.

The “experience” thing is mostly a crock of $hit too… unless one gains fresh insight from an expanding waistline and years of poor diet choices. But when this is challenged, the refrain changes again…

“ If conditions were always perfect, most of us would probably be fine still skiing leather boots. If your goal is to have fun making turns, you'll have more fun more of the time skiing plastic boots and alpine skis.”

Oh wait, it’s fun. Yeah, that must be it. Explains a lot… young ppl think it’s fun to test limits, whereas geezers mostly have fun on gear that is harder to fall over on. Because since when was skiing *ever* about perfect conditions? Perfect conditions are a pleasant accident. Their absence doesn’t stop anyone from skiing. Unless they’re a geezer, then they buy more $hit from REI or telemarkdown until their out of shape form starts to resemble a Pakistani jingle truck.

This is why geezer preaching isn’t going to advance the sport… or entice younger ppl into the sport. It’s attitudinal. Hence “ok boomer”.

And yes, plastic boots and wide alpine skis are a compensating measure. Young people use these things for real AT. Geezers use them for low angle sessions of shorter and shorter duration. But when discussion switches to light gear, the geezers reject that. Doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out why…

Not talking old, ski and trail hardened, men and women. They’re not geezers. They’re OG tele guys still seeking challenges because their feet don’t ache after skiing for 5 miles and they don’t fall off their pins because snow conditions change at the bottom of a hill. They’ve build the necessary leg, ankle, and foot strength over decades of continuous physical challenge. They might get a little winded after a climb, but they still do it because they’re OG tele guys. They’re still in the game.

This is not the same as geezers, who would feel they’re having a stroke or heart attack if they approached their age-maximum heart rates. They stopped the game before their break from skiing. They never got back in the game because they didn’t redress their decline in fitness in intervening decades. Easier to gear up and become a blow hard by telling everyone else how to ski.

If Voile only sold skis to ppl climbing hills, not riding chairs, that company would cease to exist. No disrespect to the company or it’s skis, but a realistic statement on recreational skiing as a whole.

[Sidney Dunkin]

After perusing the forum for a few days it's obvious to me who has an attitude.

[Manney]

When everything is stripped own to its core, it’s easy to debunk the bs thrown up by the geezers who are responsible for the atrophy.

Ppl need to ski how they ski. Learn by doing, observing. Not getting “told how to do it” by ppl whose abilities were either never “all that” or have declined with age and lack of practice.

Want tutelage? Take a lesson. Or ski with a better skier.

[CwmRaider]

Lack of gear progression? Who needs it? There is already enough gear available that is suited for everything from the golf course to extreme terrain, and it all works. Besides that, Voile just came out with a new binding. How much innovation has there been in alpine bindings lately?

Agree mostly, there is room for skis with better simultaneous climbing and downhill performance. Gear has come a long way past 20 years and can get better still, but usually that's a question of finding the best compromise.