3 Pin vs. Rotte Xplore

[randoskier]

If you go through the Ice skiing with NNN BC on they will be a bitch to take off unless you have magnums.

Don't ski on any ice or snow on water, that is not 100% safe, unless you are experienced with and prepared for falling in. Many have died, even very fit skiers.

I would also not use any of the "auto/automatic" bindings if there is even a small change of falling into water. The laces on boots can freeze as well when it is very cold, so I know some going on touring skates bring warm water to thaw in case of falling in (as well as dry clothes and everything else needed to be safe).

An open binding like 75mm, Rottefella Xplore and even Xcelerator or Salomon Pro-link seems like the the best option in such a case, but I have no experience with any bindings freezing. I remember reading about one skier many years ago, that almost perished in bad weather around where I live, and swore never to use NNN-BC bindings or boots again. Rottefella Backcountry Manual and Magnum seems relatively safe to me and I would not be scared to use those, but I have no personal experience with NNN-BC.

No water is 100% safe. I am well prepared for falling in, and anyone who skis in Norway (or on lakes anywhere) should be! If you ski alone keep extra clothes and socks in a drybag. This Canuck has some good pointers-

[fisheater]

That was a really interesting and informative video. That professor spent a lot of time through the ice to explain the stages a body goes through, when it goes through the ice. It’s good to know, that the first stage, when you first break through, and you’re gasping, that it’s just shock, it will last a minute or two. Just don’t drown, and it will pass, you’ll have time to save yourself

[The GCW]

It's the "gasp reflex."

It can also occur when ocean kayaking in the Pacific Northwest / any cold water, when capsizing the natural reflex when shocked with cold water is to take a deep breath but when that occurs under water, it is catastrophic.

[fisheater]

@The GCW I was aware of the gasp reflex, as I paddle in the Great Lakes. My big water fishing is primarily spring and fall. I didn’t realize, the human body “calms down” after one to two minutes. To me that is very important information.
I did have a cold water accident fishing in a new to me decked canoe. I wasn’t prepared for how the canoe rolled when filled. It was a cold swim dragging a partially filled canoe in 38 degree water. No big deal in a drysuit, but I didn’t have my neoprene gloves on as I was letting out lines when it happened. My hands were darned cold after that 20 minute swim

[mca80]

I was gonna chime in and say NO ice is 100% safe but it's already been pointed out. Here's another excellent video from a guy familiar to me through a friend who lives in WI:

[mca80]

Also, @randoskier, I have heard the "75mm is dead/dying" refrain since I started this sport a few years ago and actually find statements to this effect on reddit and even here from as far back as 10 years ago. Like some other sports with which I have intimate knowledge, I expect it will be a very slow and prolonged death not necessitating changing up gear, unless you're 20 and just starting.

Crispi just recently produced a new model Bre, which admittedly isn't much different than their Antarctic, but for them to produce new boots even if it's just a minor change is something. Those boots are for me the most comfortable ski boots I have ever worn and influenced my decision to make a lot of my skis 3pin--coupled with being able to use a surplus stiff Alico for strictly downhill trips. Stiffer dh-oriented leathers like in the old days would be nice though, that is something lacking as far as new production.

[randoskier]

@The GCW I was aware of the gasp reflex, as I paddle in the Great Lakes. My big water fishing is primarily spring and fall. I didn’t realize, the human body “calms down” after one to two minutes. To me that is very important information.
I did have a cold water accident fishing in a new to me decked canoe. I wasn’t prepared for how the canoe rolled when filled. It was a cold swim dragging a partially filled canoe in 38 degree water. No big deal in a drysuit, but I didn’t have my neoprene gloves on as I was letting out lines when it happened. My hands were darned cold after that 20 minute swim

Not as cold as her! - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_B%C3%A5genholm

She is still a radiologist- in Tromsø now

[randoskier]

This guy had a nice swim, I have close friend who lives in Heimaey, its in the Westman islands- Westman means Irishman- the Icelanders are almost 50% Irish which might explain why they have a sense of humor and the Norwegians don't. That meme of the house all alone on the barren island is his extended family's hunting lodge, they have an association that owns it- they used to net puffins there years ago when it was legal. He says they are good eating but he has not had one in years.

https://guidetoiceland.is/connect-with- ... an-islands

[stenu]

I ski mostly in Norway/Sweden/Finland and do not see that. I see a massive explosion of Dynafit AT skiing (topptur in Norwegian) in Norway. Even with global warming there is plenty of skiing in Norway and Sweden, where it gets difficult is down in the valleys and lower altitudes during long distance touring, also the season is getting shorter.

Yes AT ski touring is growing massively and despite Finnish Rotte distributor would sell 10 times more 75 mm bindings and leather boots than they used to sell a few years ago it would be just a drop in the ocean.

What the global warming does is that it makes the snow more unstable than it used to be. The progress can be seen everywhere where there is snow and mountains and even in Finland. With lighter gear you can stay away from avalanche terrain and still get your adrenaline kicks from the descends.

One of Xplore’s achilles heels is when you need to hike to reach the snow. The pins on the boots don’t really like dirt and especially they don’t like walking on ”rakka” stones (I don’t know what those eroded stones on the fells are called in English).

[randoskier]

I ski mostly in Norway/Sweden/Finland and do not see that. I see a massive explosion of Dynafit AT skiing (topptur in Norwegian) in Norway. Even with global warming there is plenty of skiing in Norway and Sweden, where it gets difficult is down in the valleys and lower altitudes during long distance touring, also the season is getting shorter.

Yes AT ski touring is growing massively and despite Finnish Rotte distributor would sell 10 times more 75 mm bindings and leather boots than they used to sell a few years ago it would be just a drop in the ocean.

What the global warming does is that it makes the snow more unstable than it used to be. The progress can be seen everywhere where there is snow and mountains and even in Finland. With lighter gear you will stay away from avalanche terrain and you can still get your adrenaline kicks from the descends.

One of Xplore’s achilles heels is when you need to hike to reach the snow. The pins on the boots don’t like dirt and especially they don’t like ”rakka” stones (I don’t know what those eroded stones on the fells are called in English).

My wife has been putting over 500 km on a year in the Norwegian fjells from Troms to Trondelag on her Xplore bindings and only had one problem and that was on the first tur- it was the problem that Rotty identified just after the launch- they fixed her boot and no problem at all since- all snows, all weather. She was a 75mm diehard before that, never cottoned to NNN BC. Now she has Xplore on all her light skis and Hammerheads on her downhill ones. I use NNN BC for nordic touring. I use alpine skis for Alpine resort skiing, and AT skis (with Sliveretta plastic bindings from a few years back- I have old 404s too in the closet) for big mountain stuff which I do less of these days- I don't think heavy telemark gear has any advantage in the Alps, no matter how emotionally attached people might be to it. It is good for powder skiing though and fine for Norway medium mountains.