Light gear does a good telemarker make?

[lowangle al]

LC, where do you draw the line between light touring equipment and heavy telemark?

I think the T4/Excusion is the at heavy end of light touring, but it also can be considered the light end of heavy gear. Because of the ability to be able to flex and lean your ankles in T4s and Excursions I put them more in the light touring category.

Heavier boots, like even the T2 hold your ankle stiff, giving you much more leverage and power at the expense of good range of motion for efficient touring, and they're heavier. When I'm wearing T4s just walking around, they feel like a heavy winter boot and I walk normally. In T2s, I know I'm wearing ski boots and it affects my gait. That's why I consider T4s as light touring.

[lilcliffy]

LC, where do you draw the line between light touring equipment and heavy telemark?

I think the T4/Excusion is the at heavy end of light touring, but it also can be considered the light end of heavy gear. Because of the ability to be able to flex and lean your ankles in T4s and Excursions I put them more in the light touring category.

Heavier boots, like even the T2 hold your ankle stiff, giving you much more leverage and power at the expense of good range of motion for efficient touring, and they're heavier. When I'm wearing T4s just walking around, they feel like a heavy winter boot and I walk normally. In T2s, I know I'm wearing ski boots and it affects my gait. That's why I consider T4s as light touring.

Excellent question and comments Al-

Although, I do not disagree with you at all-

In my very limited experience, I still classify "Excursion"-class boots (eg T4/Excursion) as modern downhill Telemark boots-
Despite the range of movement of the T4 vs T2-
I still get "mountains" more support, stabilty and leverage with my T4 than I get with even the burliest Nordic touring boot (I was marvelling at it just this week- switching from the Svartisen to the T4- I was amazed by how much more stability the T4 offered- and in particular, how much more leverage I got from the T4 when I flexed at my ankles- yet, was also very much aware of how much more flexible and fluid the Svartisen is in XC mode...)

So- yes- agree- and this gets back to my original comment re terms of reference-
What do we mean by "light"?
If what we are talking about is purely the spectrum of modern downhill Telemark boots- than yes, the T4/Excursion is at the "lightest" end of that spectrum- but, I don't think that makes my T4 a Nordic touring boot-
Which I think has been Lo-Fi's (and yours) point for years-
mainly- if you want to charge downhill- get modern downhill Telemark equipment- period.
(And within the domain of modern downhill Telemark equipment there is a spectrum of support, stability, and flexibility, range of motion.)

[greatgt]

What? Never needed any downhill type of equipment to ski anything. Lift served Ski areas so so. Places like Tuk's awesome. And light cc gear over time will make you wicked good! You get to FEEEEEELLLLL the feel. Awesome! TEven an oldie like me gets the thrill when conditions allow. Like the entire wintah this season. TM

[lowangle al]

^^^"when conditions allow"^^^

With heavier gear, conditions will "allow" more often. More fun more of the time.

"feel" means different things to different people. I like the feel of big skis in the powder, as all that surface area has a greater interaction with the snow. All that surface area and the greater interaction with the snow makes your skis more responsive and maneuverable. Wider skis also typically have more sidecut. This also makes them more responsive and maneuverable on packed snow.

[lilcliffy]

@greatgt
I think you are missing my point...(I wonder if there is a pattern here- in both directions!)

In the Northeast, I generally do not tour on modern dowhilll Telemark equipment-
and I routinely ski steep terrain on Nordic touring equipment.

But, I would never claim that I can downhill ski to the same extreme on Nordic touring equipment, that I can on modern downhill Telemark equipment.

[Inspiredcapers]

Gonna agree that heavier gear gives a lot more for options. Here in western Canada the snow conditions ate so crazily variable that something easily skiied in light gear early in the day is gonna change and F’k you up later.

[Lhartley]

@greatgt
I think you are missing my point...(I wonder if there is a pattern here- in both directions!)

In the Northeast, I generally do not tour on modern dowhilll Telemark equipment-
and I routinely ski steep terrain on Nordic touring equipment.

But, I would never claim that I can downhill ski to the same extreme on Nordic touring equipment, that I can on modern downhill Telemark equipment.

This thread is drifting so far from the original article attached. Nobody was saying that for maximum performance choose light gear(well maybe one person did, God bless his heart). The statement was that if you are competent on your light gear making telemark turns it'll in turn help you progress on your heavier gear making telemark turns. I think I chose a bad subject name for the thread, its throwing people off

[greatgt]

Have tried all kinds of gear but the best is the least. Pins leather and skinnies gives me the most bang for the buck. When I WAS young did the deed on skinnies, anywhere and time. Still do. BUT, have to adjust for my age. Have not been seeking anything all that challenging for a while. Mostly if not exclusively moderate hardwood skiing in the nowhere. Light gear gets me there easily and in powder and corn the turns just appear as if in a dream. On heavier gear the feel is obliterated. To each his own, but if your just starting think of the road less traveled, it made all the difference. Thanks Frost! TM

[telerat]

Gear that matches the application, skill and preferences is the best, and proper training helps with anything.

I don't think I would have the same skill on narrower skis and any backcountry/XCD tour, without doing lift served skiing on my heavy telemark gear and many many turns in varying conditions. Practice on narrower skis was also needed to be proficient on them, but I am unsure of how much it transfers to the heavy gear.

I would not be without track skis, narrow and wide xcd/backcountry skis, nor my telemark skis with tall plastic boots.

[phoenix]

"Gear that matches the application, skill and preferences is the best, and proper training helps with anything.

I don't think I would have the same skill on narrower skis and any backcountry/XCD tour, without doing lift served skiing on my heavy telemark gear and many many turns in varying conditions. Practice on narrower skis was also needed to be proficient on them, but I am unsure of how much it transfers to the heavy gear.

I would not be without track skis, narrow and wide xcd/backcountry skis, nor my telemark skis with tall plastic boots."

This.