Integrated kicker skin- feeling a little underwhelmed

[lilcliffy]

So I haven't had a chance to test Asnes' Skin-Lock yet- planning a whiskey-inspired repair with my old friend in his man cave.

However, I have been testing Fischer's Easy Skin on both the E-99 and the E-109- I have been testing the 35mm and the 50mm on both skis- in a wide range of snow conditions. The early snow storms were warm and wet- followed by cold = lots of hard and refrozen snow. Early this week we got a foot of very cold fluff on top of the 2 feet of condensed base. So snow conditions:
- warm and wet
- hard, dense
- crust
- icy and refrozen
- cold, fluffy powder

The terrain is a mix of xcountry, and moderate climbs and descents (100-300m verticals).

A few initial observations:

1) On these double-cambered skis- especially the E-99- I only find the wider 50mm skin to offer any truly effective grip.

2) Out of the box, the Easy-skin is long enough to serve as a light-duty climbing skin- or, a traditional kicker skin (i.e. pulling/carrying significant weight).

3) As a replacement for kick wax or scales when xcountry skiing, they do probably need to be cut to just ahead of your heel. The problem with cutting the skin is that it would significantly reduce grip for climbing and/or utility (see #2).

4) Waxless scales perform better in warm wet snow.

5) Grip wax performs better in cold fresh snow.

I have decided that I am reluctant to cut these skins- because I do appreciate the extra grip for climbing- and I do regularly pull a heavy load- CURRENTLY FULL OF CHILDREN.

I say that I am a little underwhelmed because for some reason I thought that they would significantly change my ski setups- I find that they won't.

In the end- for me- they are simply a kicker skin. Are they better than a traditional kicker skin? Sure they are- they are seamless and integrated into the base.

BUT- I don't see myself ever using them as a replacement for grip wax or waxless scales. Not unlesss I had two sets cut to different lengths- which is beyond even my CRAZY ski gear obsession.

BTW- the 35mm mohair skin-locks are in the mail...

[MikeK]

Good for a backup I suppose... or for people who want to do laps without wax.

I think the 35mm Mohair trimmed short and a 45mm nylon left long may be able to hold it's own though with the Asnes. You might be able to carry both and get through pretty much anything with no wax at all.

I'm really thinking of just waxing and tossing on the nylon skins I already bought if I need to get up something steeper than my wax can handle. I'm not even planning on scraping it unless it was sticking (we'll see how that actually works).

[Cannatonic]

thanks for this review! sounds about right to me - mostly they serve as a lightweight climbing skins. Much easier to put on and take off, and 1/3rd the weight and bulk of full skins. Fishscales work so well on spring corn, not sure a skin can ever match them for kick & glide. Have not tried it yet- will be interested to see how the narrower mohair ones work.

[anrothar]

I think of them as ideal for variable snow around freezing. They somewhat solve the grip in the shade, slip in the sun problem, especially if some of the conditions are icy. They're also great if I'm going to be dealing with warm, wet snow for only a portion of a trip, but cold snow for the majority of the mileage. Example: 3 day trip that starts around sea level on warm wet snow, but spends the end of day 1, all of day 2 and the beginning of day 3 at higher elevation in cold, dry snow. The kicker would allow reasonably quick travel through the warm stuff, but allow you to enjoy the fast and efficient grip/glide of kick wax the rest of the time.

[lilcliffy]

Anrothar-
This is an excellent example of where I can see myself using them effectively- on a long distance trek, through a range of temperatures and snow conditions.

[lilcliffy]

for people who want to do laps without wax.

I can definitely see this. And no scales on the downhill!

I think the 35mm Mohair trimmed short and a 45mm nylon left long may be able to hold it's own though with the Asnes. You might be able to carry both and get through pretty much anything with no wax at all.

When the conditions are right for grip wax- you get the best imaginable balance between grip and glide.

I'm really thinking of just waxing and tossing on the nylon skins I already bought if I need to get up something steeper than my wax can handle.

The wonderful thing about grip wax is that you can just extend it forwards for the extra grip when needed.

That "extra bit of grip" would actually mean more to me on a waxless scaled ski actually. I often want the scales to offer just a bit more grip on the uphill- snapping the integrated skin on would do it. I would actually use the easy-skin on my E-99/E-109 Crowns more often than I will on the waxable base.

[MikeK]

I'm really thinking a.k.a. speculating that the nylon skin will have more grip than wax, even an extended pocket.

It's something I'll have to test myself and see if I wind up ever using them.

I could see in some cases, now, where the skins might compliment the scales... but the Fischer scales are so good, I'm not sure how often that might be except when you want to perhaps get more grip and climb a steeper angle, again assuming the skin would provide better traction than the scales.

[lilcliffy]

OH- don't get me wrong- a kicker skin definitely has the potential to offer better grip than kick wax- of course with the trade-off of having less glide.

On the E-99- being double-cambered- I find that I need the full 50mm easy-skin to get effective grip on difficult icy snow. And the 50mm skin provides better grip on icy snow than anything other than klister.

The E-109 is not only wider than the E-99 but it has much lower, more controllable camber than the E-99. However- I also find I need the 50mm easy-skin for difficult icy snow.

On cold, fresh snow, neither the 35mm or the 50mm perform as well as grip wax- however, I would snap on the skin if I needed extra grip to climb- or, ESPECIALLY to pull/carry weight.

On warm wet snow- the waxless scales offer better grip/glide than the easy-skin. The easy-skin offers more climbing and pulling grip- if it is wide enough- depends on camber as well.

Anrothar's example of a trek with a VERY wide range of temperatures and snow conditions outline where a waxable base, with the kicker skin, would really shine.

Another application is possibly "touring for turns". If you could get the kicker skin just right it would provide as good grip/glide as a scaled base, but be scale-free on the downhill!

I have noticed that Asnes is beginning to add the skin-lock tech to their "toppturskis".

[STG]

I purchased some Asnes skins for my new Asnes skis. I decided that I would stick with my current set-up because I can remove my skins without taking my skis off. I don't think I could do that with the Asnes set-up? With each lap I would have to remove my skis to take my skins off. My skins are mohair and are about 2/3s the length of the ski and I have reduced their width to provide more glide.

[MikeK]

OK - I think I finally found the time when I'd want those skins.

Went out last night after work - dark. Temps right at freezing (32F). We've had rain and snow and warm temps over the past few days but, the snow has turned to a crust. The crust last night was like real ice though. It would break and sink you about a cm, but NO GRIP with scales - there was like a real thin layer of real ice on top. I found the first condition other than glare ice where the S Bound scales don't work! I don't think any of the other designs would either... needless to say I used my edges a lot... Once you would bust it up and get to the softer under layer, it acted just like a frozen granular and had fine grip.

I've skied them in what I thought was this kind of stuff before, but never this bad.

FWIW it was that kind of snow that just makes skis go straight and go really fast too. It's like being locked into the ground.

Anyway, I wonder how a nylon half-skin would work there? Might help with the up and down (keep your speed in check).