Telemark Talk / Telemark Tips Forum

First time post, long time lurker.

I've been XC/Downhill tele skiing for ~30 years; I'm now older, fatter and mainly go XC near Boulder.

This past 1-2, I've broken two sets of Rottefella Super Telemark 3pin bindings. About two years ago, I the toe clamp on a 10+ year old SuperTele broke; I replaced and the toe clamp broke again at the start of this year. I replaced it again, and they broke again.

The damage in each case is pretty much the same -- there is a stress that builds as shown below.

I've been using the same pair of Scarpa T2's for about the last 20 years, but never had breaks like this before. I weigh more now (~290 which is why I need to go XC more). The skies I'm using are Madshus Epoch 195cm waxless. I have other skies & bindings but these have been my "go to" for the last 4-5 years because I'm not too much adventurous stuff.

Has anyone see this happen before? I'm going to replace it one more time (I already have the binding) but I'm switching my boot to an old pair of Asolo Extreme's from the '90s. I suspect that the bend of the T4 bill is causing a constant pressure on the clamp causing it to break.

If this one fails, I'm guessing NNN-BC is the only other option. I assume they have different failure modes but this is getting expensive.

That looks like a predictable stress fracture.
The way the bail is made, the 90* vertical reinforcement ends right about were the bail cracks.
Plus, I’m guessing the end of the boot’s duckbill ends right in that area.
So, all the stress on the bail is concentrated right in the spot where it breaks.
The only helpful comment I could make is to ask if the bail will hold the duckbill with “one less click” on the catch mechanism?
That would reduce the stress on the bail.

I have only use this type binding on leather shoes, but I would think plastic boots wouldn’t need that much clamping force to stay locked in.

Others here will have more experience with this binding and probably have some better ideas.

Pretty sure Voile's 3 pin bindings are tougher. Mine have tolerated tons of use with T2 Eco boots, to the point that the boots' pin holes are now quite sloppy.

X2 for the Voile Heavy Duty Mountaineer or 3-pin cable (which I use) with and without cable. No issues with my T-4 boots. However folks say the Super Telemark clamps tighter on some leather boots with thinner duckbills.
I have some NNN-BC gear, but prefer 75 mm for my more downhill skis. I can ski a light boot such as an Alpina Alaska, and as stout as my T-4.
For NNN-BC mounted skis I use my Alpina Alaska which is great. However my my T-4 and Ski March boots turn more powerfully than the Alaska 75.
Bottom line, for plastic boots got Voile 75 mm.
Btw, I weigh 190 lbs, and in my younger years I bent several skis into rocker skis before there was such a thing. I still ski centered, but I don’t ski light.

I've never heard of this binding breaking like that. It happening repeatedly to you makes it sounds, unfortunately, like its something you are doing.

If you want to stick with plastic boots, go with the voile 3-pin mountaineer or cable. It has been redesigned over the years specifically for plastic boots.

bgregoire wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:37 pm

I've never heard of this binding breaking like that. It happening repeatedly to you makes it sounds, unfortunately, like its something you are doing.

If you want to stick with plastic boots, go with the voile 3-pin mountaineer or cable. It has been redesigned over the years specifically for plastic boots.

I second Benjamin. My girlfriend has Excursion boots and I had to switch from Rottefella to Voile as they were too hard to « click ». I Intalled Voile Mountainsering and problem solved

If I was not 100% loyal to 3-pin, then I'd consider a free pivot binding. ¿Voile Switchback?
Heavier, and more expensive.... but should take the forces better in stride.

If I was loyal to 3-pin, then I'd go for the Voile Hardwire because the heel cables are optional, and that's how I like to party!

bouldeguy wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 10, 2021 4:34 pm

Has anyone see this happen before? I'm going to replace it one more time (I already have the binding) but I'm switching my boot to an old pair of Asolo Extreme's from the '90s. I suspect that the bend of the T4 bill is causing a constant pressure on the clamp causing it to break.

The bend of the boot sole and duckbill is called "rocker".

Telemark risers, including the Voile ones, have the front of the binding a little higher than the rear, to reduce so-called "rocker launch", which will reduce forces on your boots, bindings, and skis while you're standing on your skis in a neutral position.

It may make sense to make risers part of your plan to avoid this problem in the future.

That is a very unusual failure in that particular binding design, but it's stress fracturing for sure.
That's the kind of binding failure we used to see when tele skiers switched to stiff leather boots like Asolo Extremes and Merrell SuperComps, but were still using Geze and Troll 3 pins with wire bails...overstressed the old touring binding designs to certain destruction. Rottefella Super Telemarks helped cure that problem, but plastic boots add much more torque than leather boots ever did, even with lighter skiers.
If I were you, I'd abandon 3 pin bindings altogether and use a lightwt. cable binding, like the older Riva 2 or Chili. Light tension on the cable will suffice for touring, don't crank 'em too tight; carry a spare cable and know how to install it in the field.

I don't have a recent version of the Rottefella Super Telemark 3 pin, but the last version I owned (circa 2009) was not designed for the thick plastic duckbill of the Scarpa T2 or T4. You could close the bail, but it took a lot of force and I wasn't comfortable using it with the thicker duckbill.. I've never had a failure of the Rottefella as shown in your photo, but I've only skied them with leather boots. I've since replaced all my 3 pin bindings with Voile 3 pins and they seem to work well with both plastic and leather duckbills