Telemark Talk / Telemark Tips Forum

Hello all, I'm probably just a little heavy for my skis (gamme 210s) at 215 lbs which has made the wax pocket srink.Pocket goes from where the skins click in forward of my toe to about 4" forward of the back of the bindings.When I use the correct wax for the temp I'm not really getting the grip I need.Here is my question; would you recomend that I xtend the grip wax a little bit forward of the wax pocket, a little bit behind the wax pocket or xtend wax pocket a little in front And a little behind the wax pocket? Don't really want to add a softer wax and have to deal with wax sticking to skis. THANKS for any replies, Brian

Yes, absolutely. Go forward. Go as forward as you need. All the way to the tip of the shovel if you need to. Don't go behind the heel, no need, it does nothing back there.

If you are not getting the grip you need, it's because you haven't put enough wax on over an appropriate amount of area.

You are probably testing the "wax pocket" using the card test at home on the floor right? That only gives you a vague idea if you are too heavy for a ski-- there will be no pocket, perhaps, and you may reconsider. That does NOT tell you where to ONLY put the wax. That can change depending on snow type, wax type, etc.

But 215lbs on the 210 Gamme is totally fine. You are not too heavy for these skis. If you were-- you wouldn't be having grip issues!

Hunttr wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 14, 2022 3:58 pm

Hello all, I'm probably just a little heavy for my skis (gamme 210s) at 215 lbs which has made the wax pocket srink.Pocket goes from where the skins click in forward of my toe to about 4" forward of the back of the bindings.When I use the correct wax for the temp I'm not really getting the grip I need.Here is my question; would you recomend that I xtend the grip wax a little bit forward of the wax pocket, a little bit behind the wax pocket or xtend wax pocket a little in front And a little behind the wax pocket? Don't really want to add a softer wax and have to deal with wax sticking to skis. THANKS for any replies, Brian

I weigh about the same as you, and put kick wax in the same spot as you.

I increase the amount of grip I get by applying multiple layers of wax. Sometimes 3-4 layers deep.

Hunttr wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 14, 2022 3:58 pm

Pocket goes from where the skins click in forward of my toe to about 4" forward of the back of the bindings.

I misread this-- I thought it was 4" forward of the binding. This is a normal wax pocket. Follow @riel advice. And you can still go forward if you want.

Oh, one thing I do notice is that with the Gamme I need to be a little more precise with kick & glide motions than with most of my other skis.

I really need to kick down with the static foot to get good grip on downhills, but when I do that I can go straight up hills that other people are herring boning up. With a good kick down you can get more than your entire body weight on the ski temporarily, and really push that wax down into the snow.

Kick straight down with your static foot, while you swing your gliding foot forward.

I’m 190 lbs but I ski with a rucksack frequently so I guess I’m heavier then. My basic Gamme wax pocket is from in front of the heel to the skin attachment point. Perhaps you weren’t using a soft enough wax? If it isn’t gripping at all, I don’t bother extending I go warmer. When I started waxing I was more cautious, but now I go warmer. The worst thing that can happen is that the snow sticks to the wax and I need to scrape it off. We may be able to help more if we knew the temperature and the type of snow, for example powder, still fresh, packed and transformed, ecetera.

Thanks for the replys. I do typically put on 4 layers of kick wax, iron in first layer.Also always trying to improve on technique because I am new to the sport.I haven't had a bad experience with slipage just trying to improve.Is my thinking correct when I say a heavyer person on a particular length ski will have a smaller kick wax pocket then a lighter person? Sounds like if I wanted to xtend kick wax a little I should xtend forward and not backwards.

What I’ve noticed:

Is what “reil” (Mon Feb 14, 2022 2:41 pm,Post) is saying with some additions.

Gamme is an educator. Paying attention has rewards. You’ll notice when exaggerating pushing down on the cambered wax pocket, when climbing, You get better results. Since You are already adding force and it’s perhaps a brief force, where You pick and choose where You add that force, You find yourself in a rhythm similar to an old man jogging. So use it and jog up the ascent in astronaut mode. Slowish to regulate breathing so You don’t need to stop; only slow down, but don’t stop.

Gamme is the professor. The camber is the eagle’s talon.

You don’t need to iron. I don’t take one in My pack…

2 days ago I added BLUE all the way to the contact tip because I was ascending some steeper ramps and was getting some missed grip. The eagle talon is something You will feel with use and You’ll know and sense what and where wax needs to go. You’ll learn to sense the ski is failing from deficient grip in front of where You last added wax!!! -You will see and feel the failure and know where to add attention.

Become one with the ski and become one with the wax and become one with all Your surroundings. Pay attention. Learning; a favorite thing is at the tip of Your mind.

I have the feeling that if and when I get another Asnes, Gamme will make that new universe a breeze.

Hunttr wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 14, 2022 3:58 pm

When I use the correct wax for the temp I'm not really getting the grip I need.

Correct wax depends not only on temperature, but partially on the type of snow you are skiing on. Image below shows what Pinnah has used for different temperature / snow combos.

Pinnah advices to coat klister (or soft wax) with harder wax to prevent dirt and snow from sticking.viewtopic.php?f=21&t=2187&p=24151&hilit ... e7d#p24151

Spread a thin layer of harder wax on top of soft wax to make a coating. This works best outdoors, when ski and wax are cold.

For example, last Friday blue extra was not gripping, even though temperature was optimal for it. I could ski, but needed to use my upper body and poles, which created muscle tension. Ground was partially icy / frozen, half snow. I put a layer of Rex universal liquid klister on top of the earlier three layers of blue extra, plus coated the klister with blue extra. Skiing became nice and relaxed.

btw Great info in above messages +1

Everyone's covered it all already, but anyway.

Four layers of grip wax is un peut de trop in this case, I think.

Just to state the obvious, again, the kind of snow makes a big difference. If you're on two day+ old, 'transformed' or icy snow you might need a different wax to the one you'd use for fresh and fluffy (or wet) snow, even if the temperature's the same, so check the can and the temperature just to count that out.

If it were me, I'd simply scrape it all off, or base cleaner it off if you're feeling fancy, stick three thin layers of the day's wax a good few centimetres forward of where you usually stop, really don't hold back (you have nothing to lose) and then go skiing.

See where the wax wears off at the front and call that the actual front of your wax pocket.

And do you have glide wax on? Grip wax comes straight off glide wax in literally a few strokes.