Åsnes ski recommendation

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wabbenstuck
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Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2022 12:00 pm

Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by wabbenstuck » Sun Sep 18, 2022 12:41 pm

Hi folks! This is my first post here and let me say that it's been a great pleasure and very educational learning from the discussions here so thank you :)

I'm an avid XC track skiier but getting into touring/XCD and want to make my first step/leap/bound into the abyss. My dream is to do touring like shown at the end of the video here: https://youtu.be/XnUXh8ujTg0?t=723. Hills/valleys with a bit of steepness but also long periods on the flats. What I want is basically a ski that performs well on the flats, is efficient, and handles some (not so intense/steep) downhills well enough that I'm not completely out of control :) Basically I want a "minimum viable downhiller". This ideally includes some resorts/groomers/on-piste skiing. If I can swap to some stiffer boots and enjoy my time slowly practicing the telemark turn at the resort I'll be a happy camper. This may also optionally include some skinning-for-exercise at the local ski area.

Based on this criteria, and my reading on this forum, I think (famous last words) I've settled on either the Gamme54 or the Combat Nato. Since my primary goal is an efficient ski for sloping terrain, these two skis seem to fit the bill well. What I'm struggling between is the following:

1) Will the Gamme54 have too poor downhill performance for the kind of terrain I want to ski? E.g. am I expecting too much to think I can slap on some stiffer boots and ride the groomers? Could the Gamme ride the kind of terrain in the video above? Or...

2) Will the Combat Nato suit slightly steeper terrain better but ultimately be a "poor middleground" when I eventually convince myself I need to buy another ski (e.g. FT62 or Rabb68) instead?

Basically it seems to me that I would accomplish a lot of what I want with a Gamme54 + a more downhill-oriented ski, but I don't want to buy two skis yet and maybe a Combat Nato will cover most of what I want (and handle resort + fitness skinning better).

Any deep insight would be greatly appreciated :) Thanks!

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corlay
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Location: central NY
Ski style: Woodland XC-BC tours
Favorite Skis: Asnes Gamme 54, Fischer Transnordic 66, Fischer Traverse 78; Madshus Birke Beiner, Peltonen METSA
Favorite boots: Crispi Norland Hook BC, Fischer BC Grand Tour

Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by corlay » Sun Sep 18, 2022 6:31 pm

what is your height/weight.

if under 80kg or so,
lots of folks here recommend the Asnes Nansen for a good “groomers” downhill ski, that also is reasonably efficient “kick-and-glider”



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fisheater
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Location: Oakland County, MI
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by fisheater » Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:42 pm

Hello @wabbenstuck, the first thing I need to mention is that the guys in that video are really good skiers, they are really good at skiing with their dogs, their dogs are well trained, and I can reasonably assume that they have been skiing with dogs to have the right ski for their use.
Those guys don’t have to worry about optimal kick and glide, those dogs were trained athletes. I’m sure the skiers are also trained athletes.
I have been skiing a Gamme for a few years and I really like the Gamme. I am a pretty competent Telemark skier, and even though the conditions int the video looked ideal, I couldn’t duplicate the skiing exhibited in that video on my Gamme. I could on my Falketind Xplore. However while I am very pleased with the touring performance of the FT X, it isn’t in the Gamme class for touring performance.
As @corlay recommended I believe the Nansen would be a solid contender, even if you are over 80 kilos. The reason being is you are going to sacrifice touring performance for turns. The new Otto ski, and the Ingstad are supposed to offer enhanced turning, while still offering very good touring performance. I would strongly advise reading reviews of all three of those skis.
Personally I recommend what I have, a Gamme for straight up touring. I have no problem navigating terrain, however I utilize step turns, wedge Christy, wedge turns, as well as Telemark turns.
If I’m touring for turns, you can’t beat a Falketind Xplore. It really is an acceptable touring ski. It’s not in the class of a Gamme it is acceptable.
It’s my opinion that Asnes length recommendations are a bit conservative.
Good luck, read all the reviews. They are very good



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wabbenstuck
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by wabbenstuck » Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:27 am

Thanks for the replies!

@corlay height/weight is 187cm/85kg. I spent a long time debating the Nansen vs Gamme and ended up feeling like I will want to prioritize touring performance. But it's never an easy question :)

@fisheater I definitely am guilty of the "these guys do it, why can't I??" appeal of youtube videos in perfect conditions :) But I should have perhaps mentioned that most of the skiing I do is hut-to-hut. We did a 60km tour last year on skinny track skis and had a blast, but clearly there were issues on anything more aggressive and we were lucky that everything was pretty hard/consolidated in spring conditions. So -- I want a great hut-to-hut ski that might be passable at the resort and can push into slightly harder terrain if needed. The Amundsen is too XC focused I think, but that's where I'm not sure about Gamme vs Combat Nato, I don't have a good sense of when I would choose one over the other and what sacrifices I would be giving up. Have you ever ridden a Nato? How does it compare to your Gamme?

Longer term I think I will end up buying something like a FT like you suggest for the bigger tours. I probably shouldn't have included that video -- I was just too enthusiastic about it :)



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CwmRaider
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by CwmRaider » Mon Sep 19, 2022 9:08 am

The Åsnes skis differ by rocker, sidecut, width underfoot and stiffness.

High rocker: FT62, Ingstad and Otto Sverdrup, the latter is skinnier and more tour efficient. The high rocker shortens the effective edge making it easier to turn when there is some loose snow, but in my experience, less carvy on hard groomed alpine slopes as the front section of the ski doesn't always contact the snow. This may not matter to you if you are doing Telemark turns. Also apparently the Otto Sverdrup are not good on breakable crust but I have not tried them in those conditions.

Low rocker: Gamme, i haven't tried it but all users here are very happy with it for touring.

No rocker: Combat Nato, Nansen, Amundsen. Combat Nato has a double camber with a stiff center section and still carves quite nicely. Nansen has a rounder flex. Amundsen probably has insufficient sidecut for carving but is more efficient for touring.. The Combat Nato has noticeably higher weight, noticeable mostly to me when kick turning while climbing in steep terrain.

Of these i have owned the Nansen, Combat, green FT62 and Otto Sverdrup. I prefer the Otto Sverdrup for general purpose use, it skis downhill really well in uneven terrain. The Nansen is in my opinion the best if you like making nice open carve turns on groomed alpine pistes. I view the Combat Nato as more of an all condition touring ski, suited for deeper and more varied snow conditions than the Amundsen, at some cost to efficiency. My Nansens were the waxless variety and I did not get along with the waxless base, but I otherwise liked them a lot.

Reports here say the Otto Sverdrup is bad in breakable crust. I have not skied it in those conditions. In all conditions I have encountered it's great. The (green) FT62 was too niche for me to justify keeping it. The Nato is definitely less turny in loose snow than the Otto Sverdrup. My feeling is that the Nansen is somewhere in between the Sverdrup and the Combat Nato in terms of turnyness, while being a bit worse than either for touring efficiency.

All these skis are great and have their own strengths. If you never ski on breakable crust then Otto Sverdrup would be my recommendation. More old school skis - Nansens and Amundsens are both popular skis on typical multi day trips here in Norway, so the efficiency difference is not night and day - Nansens are perfectly capable tourers in addition to being quite good turners. The Amundsen on the other hand, has a bad reputation as a turning ski, but to people skiing them it probably doesn't matter enough.

Combat Nato vs Gamme by people who own both: http://telemarktalk.com/viewtopic.php?f ... ilit=gamme



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Musk Ox
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by Musk Ox » Mon Sep 19, 2022 1:53 pm

Roelant wrote:
Mon Sep 19, 2022 9:08 am
Nansens are perfectly capable tourers in addition to being quite good turners. The Amundsen on the other hand, has a bad reputation as a turning ski, but to people skiing them it probably doesn't matter enough.
Just want to confirm this publicly, the Nansens are really good classic "fjellski", they're not bad for distances at all, and I think (well, given my comparative lack of skill) they're a better candidate for @wabbenstuck 's "minimum viable downhill" ski than the Gammes. I own both. The Nansens are really very great fun on hills.



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lilcliffy
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by lilcliffy » Sat Sep 24, 2022 11:35 am

Hello and WELCOME wabbenstuck!
wabbenstuck wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 12:41 pm
This ideally includes some resorts/groomers/on-piste skiing. If I can swap to some stiffer boots and enjoy my time slowly practicing the telemark turn at the resort I'll be a happy camper.
This is an interesting addition to your primary desire for a traditional "fjellski" (backcountry Nordic touring ski).

Have you chosen a boot and binding?

Please stay in touch and let us know how you make out!
Gareth (lilcliffy)
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.



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lilcliffy
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by lilcliffy » Sat Sep 24, 2022 11:42 am

To your OP question of Gamme 54 vs Combat NATO-

I own and love both-

Over a number of seasons I have used the Gamme 54 more than the Combat NATO-

this is due to the Gamme 54 being a more efficient trail ski on consolidated refrozen snow.

the Combat NATO is definitely a better touring ski than the Gamme 54 in truly deep soft snow.
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.



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lilcliffy
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Location: Stanley, New Brunswick, Canada
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Occupation: Forestry Professional
Instructor at Maritime College of Forest Technology
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by lilcliffy » Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:07 pm

Musk Ox wrote:
Mon Sep 19, 2022 1:53 pm
Roelant wrote:
Mon Sep 19, 2022 9:08 am
Nansens are perfectly capable tourers in addition to being quite good turners. The Amundsen on the other hand, has a bad reputation as a turning ski, but to people skiing them it probably doesn't matter enough.
Just want to confirm this publicly, the Nansens are really good classic "fjellski", they're not bad for distances at all, and I think (well, given my comparative lack of skill) they're a better candidate for @wabbenstuck 's "minimum viable downhill" ski than the Gammes. I own both. The Nansens are really very great fun on hills.
The Nansen and the Amundsen are the archetypal fjellskis- they are the two most versatile fjellski designs-

If I am Nordic touring in hilly/steep terrain- the Nansen will ALWAYS work- no matter the snow conditions.

If I am Nordic touring on gentle/rolling terrain- the Amundsen will ALWAYS work- no matter the snow condtions.

There are skis that outperform these two classic ski designs- but they have a much narrower range of ideal conditions.

As far as Nansen vs Combat NATO- check out Gamme the Elder's comparisons:
https://www.utemagasinet.no/fjellski/te ... e-fjellski
https://www.fftv.no/fjellskiskolen-ep-3-valg-av-ski

- Nansen easier to turn than the Combat Nato
- Combat Nato more efficient XC ski than the Nansen
(though they are VERY close to each other!)

- Combat Nato has more load-bearing capacity- most notible in deep snow

- Gamme 54 more efficient XC than the Nansen/Combat NATO- but harder to turn

No surprises here- skis that are more efficient XC skis ARE harder to turn!!!
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.



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JohnSKepler
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Re: Åsnes ski recommendation

Post by JohnSKepler » Tue Sep 27, 2022 6:01 pm

lilcliffy wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:07 pm

...If I am Nordic touring in hilly/steep terrain- the Nansen will ALWAYS work- no matter the snow conditions.

If I am Nordic touring on gentle/rolling terrain- the Amundsen will ALWAYS work- no matter the snow condtions...
Can you elaborate on the word "work" in these two statements? I'm putting together a three-ski quiver for this winter. For simplicity and cost I'm using the Xplore binding with Alfa Free boots (and maybe an Alaska Alpina if I can swing it!)

A wax ski that'll get me there but shine on moderate downhill. For that I've chosen the FT62. I was lucky to get a pair from REI but I think they are all gone now.

A wax ski primarily for efficient skiing on a groomed track. Not chosen yet.

A waxless ski that is in between. I'm looking mostly at the Asnes line because, frankly, there are SO many choices I'm trying to limit with something arbitrary. Asnes makes great skis across a broad range. I'm looking more and more at the Nansen and Amundsen for this in-between ski. So what do you mean by "works".

I've not seen the Nansen for sale anywhere. Either they've not come out for this year or they already appeared and are gone. I don't have a good feel for this product cycle.

Thoughts?
Veni, Vidi, Viski



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