Excursion Boot Modifications ?

[Salto]

I have had a love hate with my Excursion boots for over 10-years. They always fit a touch loose on one foot and I find the cuff to hurt my legs (I am 6'-5" - so they feel real short) and the softness coupled with lack of ski lock mode to send me into the backseat on less than ideal snow - which is encountered often here in Colorado above tree line. In the past I skied these boots with the Karhu Guides and now I am skiing with Voile hyper-vector and X2s.

So, I found some new g-ft liners (likely from a syner-g) and replaced my old worn short liners. Big improvement and little downside for me on the uphill.

I was thinking of the following mods to stiffen up little bit but still keep the touring dna.

1. New stiffer tongue from the T2 or equievelent.
2. Power strap.

Anybody here modify their excursions to be a little more downhill focused? I see folks going opposite ways with lightening up stiffer boots.

[fgd135]

I'd replace those Excursions with T2Ecos. There's not much wt difference at all, but you'll have a higher boot with more support and control in turns, lockable forward lean adjustments, so no back seat stuff, and it tours as well as Excursions, IME, since the cuff has a tour setting. The fit overall is dramatically better, and that probably makes it a great all around boot, with no heel lifting inside the liner when touring, snug ankles, and has an excellent heat-fit liner that can be re-heated and re-fit if needed over time.
Drop a dime, get new boots.

[phoenix]

I have a pair of Excursions, and Hyper UV's with Switchbacks. HAve pretty much the same experience with them as you describe. Modified them a bit trying my T1 liners and a Booster strap (T-nut added to back of the cuff for that, and a grap loop for pulling on the boots. Results were not significant.

Finally gave in and bought a pair of T2 Eco's last week; only skied them once so far, but, for me, the T2 fit is excellent, and the flex is quite nice for tele, and provides the transfer of forward pressure which the Excursion lacks.If the T2's fit you, you'll be pleased with the performance. Regarding the weight difference, the T2's feel sort of the same, or even lighter (though they weigh a little heavier) due to the fit, flex, and more trim overall design of the shell. So fgd is pretty spot on (as usual).

[lowangle al]

I've skied vector/hyper vector with T2 ecos, T4s and most recently Excursions. I don't think either the T4 or Excursion are enough boot for bad snow. I haven't worn my T2s since I got my T4s and I don't miss them. I also don't ski poor quality snow anymore. If I knew I was going above treeline and wasn't sure of conditions I would wear my T2s. On firm wind buffed or icy snow neither the T4 or the Excursion has enough leverage to get that ski on edge.

The Excursion is a great boot for soft conditions, I'd try to use them for that.

[Salto]

We all seem to be in agreement on excursion limitations! Until I find a good deal on t2 or similar, I’ll keep tinkering. Wish my old t1 tongues would work, but they wrap around d the last.

If I get a t2, I may also be tempted to simplify and go 3-pin binder. The x2 is cool when it gets steep, like + 10 degrees, but on the flats a simple 3pin would be cool….my favorite touring binding to date were the litedogz. Skied them with not excursion and t1.

Let it snow.

[JB TELE]

I'd replace those Excursions with T2Ecos. There's not much wt difference at all, but you'll have a higher boot with more support and control in turns, lockable forward lean adjustments, so no back seat stuff, and it tours as well as Excursions, IME, since the cuff has a tour setting. The fit overall is dramatically better, and that probably makes it a great all around boot, with no heel lifting inside the liner when touring, snug ankles, and has an excellent heat-fit liner that can be re-heated and re-fit if needed over time.
Drop a dime, get new boots.

In my experience there is a massive difference in range of motion between the T4 and the T2 due to the taller cuff and the lack of cuff movement in walk mode (compared to AT boots or the new TX pro). The sole on the T4 is also a lot more flexible. The T4 tours like a leather boot. T2 tours like a heavy backcountry downhill boot.

[lowangle al]

In my experience there is a massive difference in range of motion between the T4 and the T2 due to the taller cuff and the lack of cuff movement in walk mode (compared to AT boots or the new TX pro). The sole on the T4 is also a lot more flexible. The T4 tours like a leather boot. T2 tours like a heavy backcountry downhill boot.

I agree about the difference in ROM between the two boots. The T4/Excursion feels like a regular boot when I'm walking, in a T2 I know I'm in a downhill ski boot. I like that ROM for not only up but for the down too, that's why I haven't worn my T2s since I got the T4s.

The problem is, it's not enough boot for that ski in difficult conditions. When I ski, my goal is to find good snow, so either the boots work or I don't make any turns that day. If my goal was to ski to a summit or I was going with a group and had to stick with them regardless of conditions I wouldn't feel comfortable with the lower boots unless I knew for sure what the conditions were.

Salto, if you ever tour with your X2s in ski mode you will have less ROM with the T2 for kick and glide. You can feel the tip pressure slow you down. I'd recommend the original SB. I think it's the best 75mm binding for a mix of touring and downhill.

[scottyX]

i've skied excursions, t4s, and t2s for years and agree with all the above.

i assume you want to keep the ROM and easier flex of the excursion (which i also love about that boot). maybe it's just me, but in the t2, i've never been able to get nearly as wide a ROM or as ergonomic a flex while touring compared to the excursion, even with buckles undone etc.

the only thing i can think of that might get more support for bad snow/steeps and maintain as much flex and ROM as possible from the excursion is grafting the cuff of the t2 onto the excursion. i think even accounting for the age of the boots, the t2 plastic is a bit stiffer than that in the excursion. so you'd get stiffer plastic, a slight increase in cuff height, a better power strap, and the instep buckle, which should help with bad snow especially. and keeping the softer tongue of the excursion should help maintain some flex in the ankle area.

i have some older t2s kicking around, and i think i've talked myself into trying this.

[fgd135]

In my experience there is a massive difference in range of motion between the T4 and the T2 due to the taller cuff and the lack of cuff movement in walk mode (compared to AT boots or the new TX pro). The sole on the T4 is also a lot more flexible. The T4 tours like a leather boot. T2 tours like a heavy backcountry downhill boot.

The OP interests are about improving on the performance of the Excursion when used as a tele boot...Even forgetting that he's is probably a big or tall guy, with a size twelve boot, the leverage needed for good downhill control far exceeds what is available from either the Excursion, or the T4 on anything but low angle terrain--although Excursions and T4s have more control than leather boots.

A boot that does everything reasonably well is always a compromise at some level...

Imho, on very long tours & low angle tours Excursions work pretty well--excepting the loose heel fit and slop of that boot--but lack control in weird or moderately steep snow.
As far as modding the Excursion with a T2 cuff, I think it might work, but you also may find that the stiffer taller cuff on the soft plastic lower of the Excursion may over torque the cuff pivot points, causing cracks and failure where the t-nuts attach to the lower. Carry some duct tape and Voile straps, just in case, it can be a long walk back to the trailhead with only half a boot.

[phoenix]

I'm skeptical about a T2 tongue actually improving the performance; I think the flex of the bellows is so soft, the stiffer cuff won't really do anything. That was the case when I tried the T1 liner and booster straps.