Telemark Talk / Telemark Tips Forum

Hi there.

I snapped one of my Fischer Rebound skis in half last season, so I had to replace them. I found a pair of Fischer Excursion 88 Crown skis at discount and snapped them up. Now to mount bindings...

So the inevitable question: Where to place the binding?
- Cord center?
- Balance point? (Probably not, as these are meant for Nordic backcountry skiing)
- More forward? (Ball-Of-Foot-On-Running-Surface?)

I'll be putting Voile 3-Pin Mountaineer bindings on the skis.
Boots will be vintage Merrell Ultra (tall with pebax cuff inside the leather, like Asolo Extreme).

Intended terrain is ungroomed, woods roads, lower angle hiking trails, lower angle off-trail/forest skiing in Northeast USA (upstate NY, Vermont, NH, etc.).

The idea is to use the setup for 'rugged touring' with the emphasis on touring but still with telemark turns where I can get 'em. Think Avalanche Pass Ski Trail (if you know what I'm saying...).

What would you do?

My Falketind Xplore 196 cm is mounted at balance point, but that also happens to be chord center as well.

I skied my Tindan 86 and made turns at a balance point, including at the ski hill. I have moved it forward to boot center on boot center mark. A forward move of about 3cm. I haven’t skied it yet. I’m sure it will be faster edge to edge. I am skiing that ski with a T-4 and 3 pin Hardwire.

I’m guessing skiing in the land of the ski trail that can’t be wider than 10 feet (Forever Wild) being quick edge to edge matters.

I would mark pins on BP and pins on chord center. From there I would start scratching my head.

BTW I plan on heading your way in February. Avalanche Pass ski trail is on the list, but the list is longer than the days I have. I drove through the Park last year before crossing Lake Champlain at Crown Pointe. I skied Vermont and it was great, but the Daks are too interesting to drive through without skiing there at least once!

Love it or hate it, Dacks skiing is a thing unto itself. Most people call it 'crappy' skiing. I love it. I guess I'm just a little bit crazy.

Those narrow confines and frequent thicketeering are why I choose my Nordic 'XCD' backcountry skis shorter than manufacturer recommendations.

The Green Mts do generally get more snow, though. Sad, but true.

rongon wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 09, 2025 1:39 pm

Intended terrain is ungroomed, woods roads, lower angle hiking trails, lower angle off-trail/forest skiing in Northeast USA (upstate NY, Vermont, NH, etc.).

The idea is to use the setup for 'rugged touring' with the emphasis on touring but still with telemark turns where I can get 'em. Think Avalanche Pass Ski Trail (if you know what I'm saying...).

What would you do?

Before anything else, I would measure where the balance point is, and where the center of my boots are where the bindings are mounted at the balance point. On my Traverse 78, the nordic rocker is such that the balance point is about 4-5" ahead of the narrowest point of the sidecut, resulting in the working middle of the ski (on hardpack) almost right under the middle of my boots when the bindings are mounted at balance point.

I might mount them a little bit ahead of the balance point, but no more than having the narrowest point of the sidecut under the exact middle of my boot. That might only be about a 1" move.

I would want to stay close enough to the balance point that you I still side step. The binding/boot combo must still be able to lift up the tail of the ski.

At balance point is better for kick and glide.

Ahead of balance point is better for trail breaking, since you have your weight a little further forward, resulting in the skis being more level while breaking trail.

Ahead of balance point can be better for making turns on harder packed snow, but the nordic rocker probably already takes care of most of that.

Don't move your boot too far forward, or the tips won't float to the top properly when skiing down soft, fresh snow.

After measuring everything, chances are you'll end up pretty close to the balance point.

Pin line on balance point is the standard for nordic cambered skis. It's what every manufacturer recommends and that's the way any reputable ski shop will mount them if you don't specify otherwise. Some people do boot center on balance point for better turns, but that makes more sense for the s-bounds or the asnes falktentind and rabbs. But even Asnes recommends pins on balance point.
The excursion is more touring oriented and less turning oriented that the skis I mentioned. It wouldn't make sense to anything other than pins on balance point.

I measured where cord center is, which is half of 176 cm, or 88 cm from the end of the tail (or the tip, your choice).

I measured where the balance point is. That turned out to be 90 cm up from the tail, which is 2 cm ahead/in front of the cord center line.

Strange, but true.

I'll be mounting these Excursion 88s at pins on balance point, thank you!

Now I'm left with the burning question of...
10mm risers?
Or 3-Pin bindings right on the skis?
--

I have my Falketind Xplore mounted on the 10 mm riser. I remounted them to install the 10 mm riser. The only reason was to have a place to hook the Rotte ST hardwire on the heel piece, where it sits except for good downhill sections.

Unless the Ski will be used for:
riding chairs
yo-yo-ing

or maybe if the ski has a "perma-skin" affixed.

Otherwise, I would never consider deviating from pin on balance point.

If "turns" are a priority, just choose a ski more tuned for that,
instead of trying to force a wide touring ski into that box.
(my opinion)

Since I'd snapped my beloved Rebounds last season, I needed a new pair of XCD skis. I bought these Excursion 88 skis in 179 cm length because I used to have a pair of the Outtabounds in 169 cm length and found they worked great as a forest wandering ski.

What I liked about the Outtabounds was that they responded very well to being used with 2-buckle plastic boots, making them surprisingly turnable (low angle bumps at Belleayre, even), but felt noticeably more cross country oriented when used with leather boots.

However, as my skiing progressed, I found that the 169 length is just too short. Too slow on the flats and not enough float in the woods. So I got this pair of Excursion 88s in 179 length.

I'd mostly be using these for skiing hiking trails in the southern and western Adirondacks. I'm not overly concerned with slowness on the flats or on hard-packed snow (I have a different setup for that kind of thing). But I do need them to be able to make some short radius turns once in a while. If I can link turns with them then all the better. I think since I was enjoying my Rebounds in 179 length these will be even better.

Yes I am mounting the bindings with pins on balance point. On these skis, it turns out the balance point is farther forward than cord center. Sold!
--

"BTW I plan on heading your way in February. Avalanche Pass ski trail is on the list."

Good choice, that tour is not to be missed, still my single favorite tour. First skied it in the 80's. And if you happen to have the time and inclination, Marcy is one hell of a wild and fun down-mountain trail skiing experience.