2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

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lilcliffy
Posts: 4133
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Location: Stanley, New Brunswick, Canada
Ski style: backcountry Nordic ski touring
Favorite Skis: Asnes Ingstad, Combat Nato, Amundsen, Rabb 68; Altai Kom
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Instructor at Maritime College of Forest Technology
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by lilcliffy » Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:26 am

Roelant wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:16 am
I tried to measure the weight required to press two skis together but couldnt get reproducible results for both Combat and Nansen. My qualitative squeeze tests still suggest that the Nansens are a little bit, but not hugely softer.
Here are some other observations about the flex.
I placed blocks between the skis at the tips and tails at the zone where the tips start rising (similar distance from the tips in both instances) and clamped the skis together on the front riser plate just to the rear of the 75mm bindings, presumably close to where the most of the foot pressure would be.
Åsnes Combat Nato 210 cm:
Nato Flex.jpg

Åsnes Nansen 205 cm:
nansen flex.jpg

These pictures highlight a major difference in flex pattern between the skis.
The Combat Nato bases are in contact from behind the heel all the way to the skin lock. And the skis are actually partially separated in between these two contact points at the front of the riser plate. This highlights a long stiff central portion and significantly softer tips.
The Åsnes Nansen are in contact from behind the heel to just in front of the riser plate. The flex is more gradual. I suppose this is what is meant with round flex. They pressure naturally into an arc.
I think this is why the Nansen feels like a better turner, in spite of the Nato having more sidecut
@Roelant
Hi Roelant!
I am wondering if you might do a similar flex-pattern comparison of the tail of the Nansen vs Combat Nato?
I am wondering whether the round-flex of the Nansen is true for the entire length of the ski.
Hope your summer is going well!
Best,
Gareth
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.

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CwmRaider
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by CwmRaider » Thu Jul 15, 2021 2:59 pm

lilcliffy wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:26 am
Hi Roelant!
I am wondering if you might do a similar flex-pattern comparison of the tail of the Nansen vs Combat Nato?
I am wondering whether the round-flex of the Nansen is true for the entire length of the ski.
Hope your summer is going well!
Best,
Gareth
Hi Gareth
Yup I'm sipping a Norwegian whisky and taking some "me time", our little 7 month old guy doesn't allow me to flex skis too often. Though I can almost ski out of the door, so this winter I could ski a couple of times a week as "exercise". But it was an time efficient affair, haha, maximum 2 hour tours :)

The highlight this winter was a short but fun tour with a borrowed Fjellpulk and our boy in there. He seemed to be happy, we will get a second hand one before next winter.

I don't want to make noise in the house, so I am not going to flex them right now but I'll try to remember when I have the chance :D



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Woodserson
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by Woodserson » Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:50 am

lilcliffy wrote:
Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:26 am

@Roelant
Hi Roelant!
I am wondering if you might do a similar flex-pattern comparison of the tail of the Nansen vs Combat Nato?
I am wondering whether the round-flex of the Nansen is true for the entire length of the ski.
Hope your summer is going well!
Best,
Gareth
I have the previous generation of Combat Nato's-- I believe. They are the ones that came out when the Ingstad didn't have rocker, IIRC-- so prob the 2015's???

I can help if Roelant is occupado.



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lilcliffy
Posts: 4133
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm
Location: Stanley, New Brunswick, Canada
Ski style: backcountry Nordic ski touring
Favorite Skis: Asnes Ingstad, Combat Nato, Amundsen, Rabb 68; Altai Kom
Favorite boots: Alpina Alaska BC; Lundhags Expedition; Alfa Skaget XP; Scarpa T4
Occupation: Forestry Professional
Instructor at Maritime College of Forest Technology
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by lilcliffy » Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:55 am

I don't think that the Combat NATO ski has ever been updated.

Woods- you also have the current Ingstad- it would help to have that ski in comparison as well.

What I am interested is in the combination of flex pattern and stability in the tail of these Nordic touring skis.

Roelant's examination of the flex pattern of the mid-section and shovel of the Combat NATO and the Nansen is very revealing- the Nansen clearly has a "rounder" flex than the Combat- making it easier to pressure into a turn.
What I am wondering is what the tail flex of the Nansen is like...

The current Ingstad does not have a "round" flex- it is quite stiff and resistant over its length- maintaining stability in deep snow-
the rockered shovel clearly enables planing and turn intiation-
but the stiff tail of the Ingstad is not easy to pressure and smear-
(the tail of the Combat NATO is stiff and resistant as well)

What I am wondering is what the tail of the Nansen feels like under pressure...
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.



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Woodserson
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by Woodserson » Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:18 pm

lilcliffy wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:55 am
I don't think that the Combat NATO ski has ever been updated.

Woods- you also have the current Ingstad- it would help to have that ski in comparison as well.

What I am interested is in the combination of flex pattern and stability in the tail of these Nordic touring skis.

Roelant's examination of the flex pattern of the mid-section and shovel of the Combat NATO and the Nansen is very revealing- the Nansen clearly has a "rounder" flex than the Combat- making it easier to pressure into a turn.
What I am wondering is what the tail flex of the Nansen is like...

The current Ingstad does not have a "round" flex- it is quite stiff and resistant over its length- maintaining stability in deep snow-
the rockered shovel clearly enables planing and turn intiation-
but the stiff tail of the Ingstad is not easy to pressure and smear-
(the tail of the Combat NATO is stiff and resistant as well)

What I am wondering is what the tail of the Nansen feels like under pressure...
See my reply on this new thread: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=4140



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The GCW
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by The GCW » Sun Jul 25, 2021 9:48 pm

Unless I'm mistaken and in case anyone is interested:

Neptune in Boulder (yesterday) has at least 2 pair of DEMO Combat Nato skis in I think 190, in house. All White, skin hole in tip...?...

& At least a couple other Asnes used / demo's...

And an assortment of new Asnes skis. I didn't inquire if they're on sale but I recall a while back on an email that they were on sale. Why would they not be? -New skis may be seen / investigated on their website.



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lilcliffy
Posts: 4133
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm
Location: Stanley, New Brunswick, Canada
Ski style: backcountry Nordic ski touring
Favorite Skis: Asnes Ingstad, Combat Nato, Amundsen, Rabb 68; Altai Kom
Favorite boots: Alpina Alaska BC; Lundhags Expedition; Alfa Skaget XP; Scarpa T4
Occupation: Forestry Professional
Instructor at Maritime College of Forest Technology
Husband, father, farmer and logger

Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by lilcliffy » Tue Feb 08, 2022 2:02 pm

Just a little thumbs-up for the Combat NATO-

we have been buried in snow for weeks now-

I have been swithcing back and forth between the 205 Ingstad BC and the 210 Combat NATO-

last weekend we took in another spectacular Upper Nashwaak glade tur on ~50cm of fresh snow- on top of over 1.5m of base-

we had 3 Ingstad/Tonje (205/195/185), one 199 Fischer 78 + the 210 Combat NATO-

while there is no doubt that the Ingstad- with its rockered shovel- is more fun when you point them downhill- and the stable flex of the Ingstad is superb in deep soft snow-

the Combat NATO is undoubtedly the best trail-breaker and climber in truly deep snow!

while I have never tried a Finnish Forest touring ski- the Combat NATO remains the best deep snow Nordic touring skis I have ever strode on!

(And despite not having the planey, surfy performance of the Ingstad- the Combat NATO was still a blast on the hills!)

AND- also- we finished out on a snowmobile track for 3kms- the longer glide zone of the Combat makes it a much more efficient XC ski.
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.



User avatar
lilcliffy
Posts: 4133
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm
Location: Stanley, New Brunswick, Canada
Ski style: backcountry Nordic ski touring
Favorite Skis: Asnes Ingstad, Combat Nato, Amundsen, Rabb 68; Altai Kom
Favorite boots: Alpina Alaska BC; Lundhags Expedition; Alfa Skaget XP; Scarpa T4
Occupation: Forestry Professional
Instructor at Maritime College of Forest Technology
Husband, father, farmer and logger

Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by lilcliffy » Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:34 am

Been on my 210 Combat NATO everday this week-
very deep, multi-layered, mostly moisture-rich snow-
amazing conditions.

The entire day- yesterday- was swix blue kick heaven- striding and charging through deep fresh untracked snow.

If I had to have only one BC Nordic touring ski for my local environmental context- it would definitely be this ski.
Cross-country AND down-hill skiing in the backcountry.
Unashamed to be a "cross-country type" and love skiing down-hill.



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GrimSurfer
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by GrimSurfer » Sun Dec 25, 2022 4:01 pm

lilcliffy wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:55 am
I don't think that the Combat NATO ski has ever been updated.
I am very certain they have not. If Asnes did update the ski, they’d be seriously jeopardizing what is likely a very lucrative contract.

Military equipment is designed to very tight specifications. Changes would likely lead to either a very expensive round of compliance checks by a third party at Asnes expense) or an open multi-national competition in which other manufacturers would be entitled to participate.

So unless NATO started the process at the end of a contract run, a manufacturer with an approved product would be insane to go down this path. Asnes would be better off developing a whole new ski while keeping Combat NATOs unchanged.

NATO isn’t a free lunch, but having a product in the NATO catalog puts it at the finger tips of 30 countries’ militaries and paramilitary organizations down to the unit level. You don’t risk this kind of sales opportunity lightly. You bend over backwards to keep it.
We dreamed of riding waves of air, water, snow, and energy for centuries. When the conditions were right, the things we needed to achieve this came into being. Every idea man has ever had up to that point about time and space were changed. And it keeps on changing whenever we dream. Bio mechanical jazz, man.



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Inspiredcapers
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Re: 2015 Åsnes Combat NATO

Post by Inspiredcapers » Thu Jan 05, 2023 2:54 pm

I’m still wanting to get a pair of these some day. Unfortunately the sale at La Cordee last week didn’t have 210’s. Norseman in Calgary still has them but that $750 price tag is a huge turnoff.



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