Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

The ultimate telemark knowledge base and encyclopedia. All you need to know about free-heel skiing. History, technical terms, glossary, how-to's and tips. Just the facts, no opinions. Your #1 place to start for everything tele.
User avatar
CwmRaider
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 6:33 am
Location: Subarctic Scandinavian Taiga
Ski style: XC-(D) tinkerer
Favorite Skis: Åsnes FT62 XP, Børge Ousland
Occupation: Very precise measurements of very small quantities.

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by CwmRaider » Tue Nov 29, 2022 6:35 am

@JohnSKepler Wax remover does the trick to remove glide wax.

User avatar
JohnSKepler
Posts: 519
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2022 6:31 pm
Location: Utahoming
Ski style: XCBCD
Favorite Skis: Voile Objective BC, Rossignol BC 80
Favorite boots: Scarpa F1 Bellows, Alpina Alaska XP
Occupation: Rocket Scientist

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by JohnSKepler » Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:19 am

Roelant wrote:
Tue Nov 29, 2022 6:35 am
@JohnSKepler Wax remover does the trick to remove glide wax.
Yes, it did!
Veni, Vidi, Viski



User avatar
JB TELE
Posts: 267
Joined: Thu May 19, 2022 12:25 am
Location: San Juan Mountains, Colorado

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by JB TELE » Fri Jan 05, 2024 12:37 am

If you expect to start skiing when it was 10-15 degrees F (-12c to -9c) and expect a daily high just above freezing and temperatures dropping a little bit before stopping for the day, assuming it's a sunny day, what would be your overall kick waxing strategy? I recently purchased some transnordic 66 waxables and plan on doing a multi day trip this winter with them. Wondering how to wax for typical Colorado winter weather which can have a huge temperature change form overnight lows to daily highs.

Can you mix hot and cold waxes to get grip throughout the day?

I also have will have kicker skins and/or full length skins if needed.



User avatar
Stephen
Posts: 1464
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:49 am
Location: PNW USA
Ski style: Aspirational
Favorite Skis: Armada Tracer 118 (195), Gamme (210), Ingstad (205), Objective BC (178)
Favorite boots: Alfa Guard Advance, Scarpa TX Pro
Occupation: Beyond
6’3” / 191cm — 172# / 78kg, size 47 / 30 mondo

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by Stephen » Fri Jan 05, 2024 2:11 am

JB TELE wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2024 12:37 am
If you expect to start skiing when it was 10-15 degrees F (-12c to -9c) and expect a daily high just above freezing and temperatures dropping a little bit before stopping for the day, assuming it's a sunny day, what would be your overall kick waxing strategy? I recently purchased some transnordic 66 waxables and plan on doing a multi day trip this winter with them. Wondering how to wax for typical Colorado winter weather which can have a huge temperature change form overnight lows to daily highs.

Can you mix hot and cold waxes to get grip throughout the day?

I also have will have kicker skins and/or full length skins if needed.
You forgot to include skiing in and out of tree shade, and changing aspects with sun exposure, or not!
I think dealing with this sort of scenario is the main weakness of wax skis and the main advantage of no-wax skis.
I’ll be really interested to hear proposed solutions!
I have been getting closer and closer to buying a Traverse 78.



User avatar
tkarhu
Posts: 319
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2022 11:58 am
Location: Finland
Ski style: XCD | Nordic ice skating | XC | BC-XC
Favorite Skis: Gamme | Falketind Xplore | Atomic RC-10
Favorite boots: Alfa Guard | boots that fit

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by tkarhu » Fri Jan 05, 2024 11:24 am

JB TELE wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2024 12:37 am
If you expect to start skiing when it was 10-15 degrees F (-12c to -9c) and expect a daily high just above freezing and temperatures dropping a little bit before stopping for the day, assuming it's a sunny day, what would be your overall kick waxing strategy? I recently purchased some transnordic 66 waxables and plan on doing a multi day trip this winter with them. Wondering how to wax for typical Colorado winter weather which can have a huge temperature change form overnight lows to daily highs.

Can you mix hot and cold waxes to get grip throughout the day?

I also have will have kicker skins and/or full length skins if needed.
This is a case where fluorinated waxes makes sense. I use Vauhti Carrot for such special cases. I think I have the GF version. It is still legal in EU I think, not the worst poison. I put a single thin layer of that on top of my earlier wax, ie. use the Vauhti Carrot for coating only.

Alternatively, a layer of liquid klister may work on top of grip wax. I use Rex Golden liquid klister. I would put a thin layer of liquid klister, and then a harder blue like Swix VR40 / VP40 on top of the klister. You use liquid klister like that, not like normal klister.

That is what I do with skis that do not have x-skins. I would have the waxes and klister with me, when skiing, and add when necessary.

For x-skin skis, I would put 30 mm mohair skins on, when biue waxes stop working. I do NOT put fluorinated coatings or klister, if I am planning to use skins on a pair of skis.

I normally put layers of different waxes on top of each other. Last time I put hardest blue, softest blue, hsrdest blue on my x-skin skis. The hard blue was Swix and the soft blue Rex. A hard wax on top of soft prevents snow from sticking to the soft wax. However, the softer wax will still grips to warmer snow from underneath the coating.



User avatar
Capercaillie
Posts: 175
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2022 1:35 pm
Location: western Canada
Ski style: trying not to fall too much
Favorite Skis: Alpina 1500T, Kazama Telemark Comp
Favorite boots: Alfa Horizon, Crispi Nordland, Scarpa T4

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by Capercaillie » Sun Jan 07, 2024 11:18 pm

JB TELE wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2024 12:37 am
Can you mix hot and cold waxes to get grip throughout the day?
A ski instructor recommended doing exactly this to me, to deal with temperature transitions from below- to above-freezing. Start with a thin single layer of the warmest temperature you are expecting, then layer the colder waxes on, thinly. The colder wax layer will wear off as the day goes on and the temperature rises, exposing the warmer wax. Works fairly well in my experience. For your scenario, assuming Swix wax, I would do first layer V55, second layer V45, third (outermost, start-of-day) layer V30.

(*I'm actually working through tins of V52 and VF40 for similar conditions; those are similar but have been discontinued)



User avatar
fisheater
Posts: 2547
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2016 8:06 pm
Location: Oakland County, MI
Ski style: All my own, and age doesn't help
Favorite Skis: Gamme 54, Falketind 62, I hope to add a third soon
Favorite boots: Alpina Alaska, Alico Ski March
Occupation: Construction Manager

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by fisheater » Wed Jan 10, 2024 10:20 pm

@tkarhu which Vaughti Carrot are you having good success, I found a few variations on my wax supplier’s web sight. Speaking of Vaughti waxes, under some situations I find Vaught Pure Pro White to be Nordic magic. It’s a wax that works really well, when it works in temps just below freezing. It’s rated for above freezing, but it has not so great for me above freezing.
@JB TELE my waxing system is simple. If I don’t have grip, I use a warmer wax. If I stick, i crayon a colder wax, and I spread gently over the warmer wax with my cork. If I build too many layers I give a quick scrape with my Swix steel wax scraper. I know most guys don’t like steel, use what you want, I’ve been using steel for a lot of years. Steel is quicker. Pinnah would use the other ski’s edge, and he had a website!
I just let the snow guide me. I’m careful to know I need klister before I use klister. I only put too warm of a klister once, i really don’t want to do that again. However, when conditions dictate klister, it can really work well.



User avatar
tkarhu
Posts: 319
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2022 11:58 am
Location: Finland
Ski style: XCD | Nordic ice skating | XC | BC-XC
Favorite Skis: Gamme | Falketind Xplore | Atomic RC-10
Favorite boots: Alfa Guard | boots that fit

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by tkarhu » Wed Jan 10, 2024 11:57 pm

fisheater wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 10:20 pm
@tkarhu which Vaughti Carrot are you having good success, I found a few variations on my wax supplier’s web sight. Speaking of Vaughti waxes, under some situations I find Vaught Pure Pro White to be Nordic magic. It’s a wax that works really well, when it works in temps just below freezing. It’s rated for above freezing, but it has not so great for me above freezing.
I have the Vauhti GF Carrot. It is a mildly fluorinated wax for coating, when temps are zero C or above.

Other Vauhti Carrots are general-use below zero waxes, like blues. People talk about ”vauhtiporkkana”, that is ”speed carrot” in English. You never know which version people refer to, except for the problem weather coating case more technical versions are best.



User avatar
fisheater
Posts: 2547
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2016 8:06 pm
Location: Oakland County, MI
Ski style: All my own, and age doesn't help
Favorite Skis: Gamme 54, Falketind 62, I hope to add a third soon
Favorite boots: Alpina Alaska, Alico Ski March
Occupation: Construction Manager

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by fisheater » Thu Jan 11, 2024 12:12 pm

👍



User avatar
Lhartley
Posts: 470
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:16 am

Re: Pinnah's Simple Kick Waxing For Touring

Post by Lhartley » Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:40 pm

fisheater wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 10:20 pm
@tkarhu which Vaughti Carrot are you having good success, I found a few variations on my wax supplier’s web sight. Speaking of Vaughti waxes, under some situations I find Vaught Pure Pro White to be Nordic magic. It’s a wax that works really well, when it works in temps just below freezing. It’s rated for above freezing, but it has not so great for me above freezing.
@JB TELE my waxing system is simple. If I don’t have grip, I use a warmer wax. If I stick, i crayon a colder wax, and I spread gently over the warmer wax with my cork. If I build too many layers I give a quick scrape with my Swix steel wax scraper. I know most guys don’t like steel, use what you want, I’ve been using steel for a lot of years. Steel is quicker. Pinnah would use the other ski’s edge, and he had a website!
I just let the snow guide me. I’m careful to know I need klister before I use klister. I only put too warm of a klister once, i really don’t want to do that again. However, when conditions dictate klister, it can really work well.
When you are "sticking" and crayon colder wax over your warmer wax, would this also solve the problem of snow sticking to wax?



Post Reply