I'm an XCD skier

[Raventele]

Depends..XCD gear (the whole range) makes perfect sense for those poaching turns in Vermont.. Or maybe Cima and his friends living in the powder and skiing the soft spring and summer snowfields..
If this damned crazy weather does not sort itself out, XCD may be gone ..period!

[MikeK]

I've sensed your frustration with XCD gear but seen as how you have the plastic boots maybe you need to step up to a more modern ski like the Vector.

All I hear about is how great they are. You surely can't ski them with leather. And you probably aren't going to do much touring with them except to climb.

And of course they are made by your favorite company in the world!

They've been out long enough and Voile has upped their line enough you ought to be able to find a used pair without breaking the bank.

[Raventele]

Well, Vectors seem like a ski I would take to the ski area just so I go maybe go SC and/or ramble between lifts without having to fuss with skins or grip wax.. I think XCD with an emphasis on the XC has fallen by the way largely..
I can ski any half-decent conditions with my Alpinas..and leathers, if I had any..

[MikeK]

I think XCD with an emphasis on the XC has fallen by the way largely..

Oh man I think you need to try some different skis then.

The S bound Fischers are absolute champs for striding. They turn as good as anything I've tried. Best all around trail ski I've been on.

The Epochs are a fine ski XC ski as well. Not the fastest but they hold reasonably straight.

I've not skied an Eon but I'm sure it tours even better while giving up some of the snappy turning in of the Epoch. I'm sure the skinnier and less shapely S bounds are the same.

The Glittertind and E99 are absolute dream XC skis. They are death traps in deep snow but on a broken out trail they fly!

A Rossi BC70 is a wicked fast xc ski. Stiffest camber of them all. Doesn't turn worth a shit except to skid on hardpack but it's a kick and glide machine. I've read all the Rossi BC skis are stiff like this.

Once you start getting up to the bigger skis they feel fine in deep snow but if you hit some crud or ruts in leathers they start getting squirrely. The more shapely they are, the more likely they will catch that shit and buck you around. So it's not all perfect. It's a compromise.

I surely know what skis of mine am grabbing depending on what I am doing. I haven't quite figured out where the Annum fits in though... it's getting heavy, wide, and lacking camber. It's definitely pushing what you call XC. I don't see as much use but for for yo-yo skiing in powdery snow. It may prove me wrong because I know people that tour with these skis.

[Raventele]

You miss my meaning..I just think less people are interested in KandG ..Most folks XCD to find turns..
People with a real emphasis on XC hit the Nordic centers..Madshus took a lot of camber out of the old Karhu line a couple years back..The last really cambered XCD ski I owned was a Rainier..Don't miss that thing much..miserable to turn except on soft snow..not good in deep snow either..and did not track all that well..

[MikeK]

Not around here Ron.

Most people on these skis are doing tours in the wilderness. Maybe some yo-yo skiing. Maybe taking them to a resort to get some practice in. A lot like what I do.

A lot of people that have the skinnier ones ski them in groomed tracks and in the woods. The make great all around xc skis but really lack the downhill aspect for the casual user. The downhill they are doing is survival.

I don't think a lot of people on the skinny end of the XCD spectrum are doing what CIMA or Johnny are doing with them. Most of those people are going right to two buckle plastics and the fatter end of the XCD spectrum. They can still tour with them but they can do that to get to backcountry glades or mountain tours.

Even a lot of the mountain tours in the east have been taken over by AT and heavy Tele. Mt. Marcy, the highest point in the state of NY is considered a XC tour. It's traditionally been done on skinnies and leathers. Not many do it that way anymore. Seems minimum now that is considered sane is on the fattest end of the XCD spectrum. I'd surely opt for those skis if I was going to do it.

Just for reference, this is a good video of skiing that trail. It's not like what you are used to:

[video][/video]

[Raventele]

Well, actually I'm quite used to skiing that sort of thing in areas where we go SC, but it's usually just to get back to a road or trail ..It's probably more an issue of survival turns than would usually interest me.. Don't care that much for skiing areas where there's such a limit on choosing your own paths..

[Raventele]

Mike, how's that an XC tour ? How would you hope to sell climbing up over that ungroomed mess as some sort of wonderful KandG experience ?? It's no more an XC experience than climbing Cima's closed DH areas is .
KandG is almost an unrelated matter..

[MikeK]

Well... the krumholtz grows thick here and the rocks are big. Choices are limited.

You have that, or slides. Or well... icy resorts.

You can find open hardwoods like the KTB ski in but not so much at higher elevations (>3500' or so). But even then there are still giant glacial erratics, spruce swamps, cliffs, icefalls, and lakes to deal with.

K&G and survival skiing are part of what you get when you go backcountry skiing in the Adirondacks.

[MikeK]

Mike, how's that an XC tour ? How would you hope to sell climbing up over that ungroomed mess as some sort of wonderful KandG experience ?? It's no more an XC experience than climbing Cima's closed DH areas is .
KandG is almost an unrelated matter..

You didn't see the whole trail. It's not like that the whole way but it's been considered a classic expert level XC ski. Most tours are not that much up and down. That one is over 3000' vertical... but it's stretched over 7.5 miles. It's not what you'd really call steep out west. It's a hiking trail. It is however steep for xc skis.