Lightweight skier sizing: Madshus Panorama M62 vs Eon vs Karhu XCD GT

[wabene]

^^yes. I have the waxable transition skin M62 and on hardpack they get a little squirrelly. Some fresh snow and they are great. But yeah I don't get it either, even the Fischer 98 (gah 68!) and 112 (78) both have a groove. I'm guessing the old Eon had the groove?

[lilcliffy]

Yes the original design of the Eon/"XCDGT" has a track groove, both on the waxless Omnitrack model and the sintered wax model.

[Redbear]

"Camber is not measured or determined by height, rather by force of pounds/gk required to flatten the ski. So you may have a "low camber" ski that is actually on the stiffer side of a "high camber" ski
with a stiffer flex. Some time in the early days of my xcd'ing and associated shop work, I read something I still recall (remarkably!) and find a good general rule. Probably from Steve Barnett's book. Went something like this: For competitive type xc skis, you should be able to close the camber of the skis (together) with both hands. For more general xc touring, with one hand. For xcd, two fingers (and of course your opposing thumb). You can kinda get a feel for it that way. If you have the good fortune to pick up the skis in a shop, rather than from the interweb"

Even though the height of the arch doesn’t necessarily represent the stiffness of the skis, it was the only measurement I could come up with to illustrate their differences. Pressing skis together definitely seems like a better way to test camber. I checked both pairs of skis and needed two hands to push the Karhu XCDs together but was able to close the Panoramas with one hand but not quite with two fingers and a thumb. Although this method becomes less scientific when you factor in hand strength. When I used to rock climb my hands were much stronger and I'm pretty sure I would not have had any trouble holding the Panorama skis together with two fingers.

[lilcliffy]

Pressing skis together definitely seems like a better way to test camber. I checked both pairs of skis and needed two hands to push the Karhu XCDs together but was able to close the Panoramas with one hand but not quite with two fingers and a thumb. Although this method becomes less scientific when you factor in hand strength. When I used to rock climb my hands were much stronger and I'm pretty sure I would not have had any trouble holding the Panorama skis together with two fingers.

Very interesting. Thank you for the report!
It seems clear- regardless of your personal strength- that your current M62 has much less resistance underfoot than the old XCD GT.
(My XCD GT and early-gen Eon are identical)
Your M62 will be easier to turn but it wont offer the kick and glide performance of the resistant XCD GT.

[lilcliffy]

The original intent was that the "XCDGT"/"Eon"/62 design had more resistance underfoot and more effective kick and glide performance than the wider, softer, rounder XCD 10th Mtn/Epoch/68 and XCD Guide/Anum/78.
Regardless- it seems clear that the current M62 does not have the same flex pattern as the old Eon.

[wabene]

The original intent was that the "Eon"/62 design had more resistance underfoot and more effective kick and glide performance than the wider, softer, rounder XCD 10th Mtn/Epoch/68 and XCD Guide/Anum/78.
Regardless- it seems clear that the current M62 does not have the same flex pattern as the old Eon.

That's too bad really, that must be why that old Eon was so popular. Nicer top sheets too.

[Peagreenboat]

Hi, Lilcliffy: I have a pair of Eons (my main quiver), and contemplating the M62.
When you say the first gen Eon- which is this one you refer to? I have the white/silver/red and not sure if this is that one and if later Eons were the same. I’d be interested in any further info as my ski is in ok shape, and I’m also considering if I get a new one (and if sans groove makes any difference), or if I get the M68 and go down a size. This is for mostly icy/crusty/corn in Australia, where the Madshus range are popular for our conditions. I find the Eon does everything (20+km flats) to downhill, though does not perfectly. I’d like a touch more turn ability.
Thanks

[lemon]

I'm no expert, but from my experience working in a ski shop, those skis just recently switched to 162,172,182 etc from 165,175,185 etc. They are the same length still but the 3cm difference is the effective edge of the ski. The front 3cm only touches the snow when skiing in powder. Again, not an expert but that was told to me before. So the 162cm and 165cm are the same length. I'm sure if you put it base to base with a 165cm ski the will look the same size. Just my two cents, I'm not an expert, im just trying to help.

[fisheater]

I can’t help. However @Rodbelan is a lighter man, and has written quite favorably about his Panorama 62. Maybe he will pipe in.

[lilcliffy]

Hi, Lilcliffy: I have a pair of Eons (my main quiver), and contemplating the M62.
When you say the first gen Eon- which is this one you refer to? I have the white/silver/red and not sure if this is that one and if later Eons were the same. I’d be interested in any further info as my ski is in ok shape, and I’m also considering if I get a new one (and if sans groove makes any difference), or if I get the M68 and go down a size. This is for mostly icy/crusty/corn in Australia, where the Madshus range are popular for our conditions. I find the Eon does everything (20+km flats) to downhill, though does not perfectly. I’d like a touch more turn ability.
Thanks

Well- the M68/Epoch has more sidecut- but it is also considerably wider- more ski to hold on edge-
what boot are you going to use?
The 68/Epoch is definitely more turn-orientated than the 62/Eon- but, the 62/Eon DEFINITELY tracks better in XC mode.
All reports suggest that the current M62 is the same design as your Eon...