question→ racing skin on Nordic touring ski?

[lilcliffy]

Question-

What is the real, practical value of being able to snap on/off a racing-climbing skin on a Nordic touring ski?

Is there a critical mass of Nordic ski tourers that have demanded this?

I now have three Nordic touring skis that have a groove cut into the tip to snap on a racing skin-
Although, I admit that it is cool to do it (I did buy a racing skin as a result)-

I must admit that the downsides vastly outweigh the extra-partial minutes to put-on/take-off conventional climbing skins...

#1→ the durability of the ski tip is fundamentally comprimised- I find myself constantly applying epoxy to the tip- both for genuine repair and preventative maintenance-
Although I actually enjoy looking after things- looking after the tip notch has become a pain in the ass.

#2→ the tip notch fundamentally prevents the installation of a full-wrap steel edge- CRAPPY.
For example, despite how much I love my Asnes Rabb 68- I have gotten over the racey racing skin- I wish it had the full-wrap steel edge of my Storetind- that has required ZERO repair or preventative maintenance after endless touring...

Fischer seems to be all-in on this at the moment- cutting racing-skin tip notcthes in all of their "Off-Track Touring" and "S-Bound" skis!

And to beat on this a bit more-
at least Asnes has the sense to try and seal off the tip notch-

My current-model S-Bound 98 has a tip notch simply cut into the tip with not even a bit of sealant applied to protect the core of the ski?!

Asnes Storetind- full-wrap steel edge:

Asnes Rabb 68- tip-notch- sealed:

Fischer S-Bound 98- tip-notch- open to the core:

BTW- both the Rabb and the 98 have regular applications of epoxy (HIGHLY RECOMMENDED).

Anyway- not the end of the world-
but, I think this is stupid.

Thoughts?

[fisheater]

I can see one advantage Gareth. I have absolutely no need for the tip notch for my local skiing. However, for my tourist skiing in the eastern mountains, I plan on purchasing a couple of full length racing skins. I have a scaled alpine touring ski, with a wall to wall skin, but some of the tours I take are pretty moderate. I have a Falketind Xplore and a Tindan 87, that both tour well. However I have climbed easily on my X-skin only to come to a steep downhill on a mountain trail. Probably not to steep to climb, but 5 or 6 miles in, solo, not seeing anyone on my way in, and with nothing to prove, getting to the top of a below tree line mountain wasn’t that important.
So, I am going to order a couple DIY skins from Skimo. I don’t think I will worry about a tail hook, but that’s still under consideration. I guess I’m kind of happy the notch is there. I’m certainly not trying to be disagreeable, just noting geography makes a big difference, and in unknown country the ability to easily attach a full skin adds a margin of safety.
The biggest damage to my skis is from rocks, I do ski through some whips, but nothing like spruce/fir country like you ski in everyday.

[lilcliffy]

Hi Bob,

Thank you for your response!

I don't mean to suggest that I think full climbing skins aren't necessary (I rarely tour without a full-length climbing skin in my pack/sled- especially in deep snow and steep terrain).

My point is that when Nordic touring, do we really need racing skins? Is it that big of a deal to take a couple of extra minutes and put on a standard full-length climbing skin?

I would much rather have a more durable tip (and higher profile trail-breaking tip!)- and have to use a standard climbing skin- then save a couple of minutes snapping on and off a racing skin...

Gareth

[JB TELE]

The idea with tip notch skins is they are supposed to be easier to pull off without taking your skis off. I've used both and haven't noticed any difference between pulling the skins from the tip or the tail. I tend to prefer pulling from the tail even if I'm using tip notch skins because that's what I'm used to.

Finding tip bracket skins for skinny skis in the United States is difficult. The narrowest readily available pomoca skin that uses a tip bracket is a minimum 100mm width at the tip (I use those on my Rabbs). The only thing I've found are the contour cross country skins sold on skimo.com. If your ski has a skin notch, there are plenty of skinny skimo race skins that utilize the tip notch. I'm guessing that's one reason why some backcountry nordic skis use tip notches now, to make finding skins easier.

Skis like the s-bound 98 are very capable of skiing slope angles that require full skins or are awkward to get up on kickers. Being able to rip skins on yo-yo laps or even at the end of a big ascent is nice but you don't need a tip notch for that. Unless you are trying to rip super fast like this guy.

[John Dee]

When I made notches I definitely questioned the need for epoxy. The tips appeared to be layers of plastic and fiberglass that were well adhered to eachother.