New Åsnes Combat NATO 62 BC

[lilcliffy]

Surely the rockered and tapered "Combat NATO 62 ski" is simply a current rockered and tapered Ingstad with a few modifications at the end of the manufacturing process?

It appears to be almost identical to the Ingstad BC...
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Having- and appreciating- both the current Ingstad and the "Combat NATO" (ie old Ingstad design)- these are very different skis- despite having an almost identical width.
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The Sverdrup/Ingstad/Nansen are very different skis again- different rocker; taper; flex; camber; resistance and tip profiles.

The Sverdrup is not simply a narrower Ingstad BC- it has more camber and resistance underfoot; and is more flexible in the shovel and tail (and the Sverdrup tail is tapered). I love the Sverdrup- but it is rarely ideal in my local conditions. The Sverdrup is poor in very deep and/or layered snow. The Ingstad BC is rock-solid stable in deep snow, despite its waspy 62mm waist.
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The non-rockered Nansen and "Combat NATO" offer the most wide-ranging performance as BC Nordic touring skis- despite having the most traditional designs.

[lilcliffy]

I have no idea what the future holds for a company like Asnes that has been bought up by a larger conglomerate...
(Interesting to note that Lundhags has been bought as well- by the same conglomerate that owns Swix I think?)

I think that the wide range of Nordic touring ski designs and experiments in the Asnes ski plethora is simply an output of passion, experimentation, and obsession. I sincerely hope that the people at "Asnes" remain free to pursue their passion, experimentation and obsession.
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(I probably should buy a couple of old-school Combat NATO skis- just in case...)

[Manney]

So one of these skis will die. Odds are it’s the old Combat NATO. Which gets back to the question of what’s the rationale behind the new one. Doesn’t appear to be anything significantly different… otherwise, wouldn’t Asnes be leaning on that as a selling point? (“It costs us less to make or we’re streamlining the range” isn’t anything that sells skis to a customer. Easy to sell in the boardroom tho. In the absence of anything to the contrary, this seems like a credible explanation for what’s happening here.)

The old Combat NATO breaks trail better, and is a more efficient XC ski.

The Ingstad turns better, making it easier for people to stay in control.

The military often seems to ski with nylon skins, while pulling sleds. This totally negates any advantage of better trail breaking or gliding.

However, when skiing with a 100lb backpack or sled, safety is paramount. A better turning ski can help with that.

The ingstad may just genuinely be a better product than the old Combat NATO, except for some niche uses that the military doesn't actually care about.

A lot of the skiing in Norway seems to be spring skiing, which is what the Sverdrup seems to be tuned for. That is going to eat into the demand for both Nansen and Ingstad.

Combining Ingstad and Combat NATO production on the same production line likely frees up some factory floor space, which may allow them to manufacture some of the skis they were unable to produce in any reasonable volume last year. Wonder if we'll see waxable MR48 return this year?

Agree 95%.

IDK if the military uses skins that much though. Never seen it on a unit level, which is where most of the XCD stuff is done with skis like the Combat NATO and USGI.

Skins are an expensive item (when scaled by a few hundred or thousand soldiers focused more on mission accomplishment than gear longevity). Somewhat challenging to properly store, compared to a capped ski which just needs a wipe. Harder in the field.

Skins not needed for military mobility skiing anyway. Take the longest ski. Drop a 180 lb solider on it. Add a 12 lb weapon and sling to a base, combat layer, wind smock and helmet. Throw an 80 lb pack on his back. You’re getting close to a 300 pound skier. There’s not going to be any problem getting that camber and grip zone down for traction.

Did some checking into Asnes’ new corporate masters tho. Will post in a day or so in the OT section. It is both interesting and a bit depressing, as these things are.

[Edit… just put up a quick piece on Asnes’ new masters. https://www.telemarktalk.com/viewtopic. ... 618#p62618 )

[Musk Ox]

IDK if the military uses skins that much though. Never seen it on a unit level, which is where most of the XCD stuff is done with skis like the Combat NATO and USGI.

The Norwegian military certainly uses skins as a matter of course.

[Manney]

Love to see some pics of that… could add it to the military ski page.

Most published photos (current to last ski season) shows troops on skinless USGIs most of the time. A few examples of Combat NATOs… not a lot of skin use though.

[CwmRaider]

Here is the call for tenders from the Norwegian Military, with deadline in november 2022

https://www.doffin.no/Notice/Details/2022-957632

They are looking for:

- Robuste ski med stålkanter, beregnet for langturer gjennom skog, myrlandskap og fjellterreng.
- Robuste ski uten stålkanter, beregnet for langturer gjennom skog, myrlandskap og fjellterreng.
- Klatrefeller
- Robuste skistøvler, med avtagbare "liners", laget for langturer gjennom skog, myrlandskap og fjellterreng, i temperaturer mellom -40 grader og +10 grader Celsius
- En binding som kan benyttes med feltstøvler
- En BC-binding
- Teleskopiske skistaver

- Robust skis with/without steel edges for long tours in forest, moors and mountain areas
- climbing skins
- robust ski boots with removable liners, for the same use as the skis between -40 and +10 degrees C
- A binding that can be used with field boots
- a BC binding
- telescopic ski poles

[Manney]

Awesome. Thanks for the info… links.

Maybe the skins are used in the mountains (which, of course, makes sense)? All the US Marine Combat Camera photos shows troops on gentle rolling terrain in Norway. Probably because the USMC doesn’t do mountain/XCD in any significant way.

Hard finding good pictures from Scandinavian sources. It’s nothing special for these countries, so not newsworthy like it is here in the States.

[CwmRaider]

https://www.mercell.com/m/file/GetFile. ... &version=0
Technical requirements for the tender (skis etc)
It's described that the skis should have early rise and taper. And must have: a width between 61 and 68mm underfoot, sintered base and hole in the tip, compatibility with nnn-bc and a reinforced binding area, and possibilities for both short and long skins. Hmmm I wonder which skis satisfy this requirement. Åsnes updated the design to be a prime contender.

[Manney]

This is brilliant, @CwmRaider. Many thanks for sharing.

[Manney]

It appears that the new Combat NATO 62 variant meets the Norwegian Army spec. The BC version does not.

Key differences… early rise, tail protector.

The early rise requirement might explain the Norwegian rocker noted in the description. The Norwegian Army requirement also mentions energy efficiency (presumably on the tour… glide). Skis with a greater camber are generally more efficient on firmer snow.

Both skis appear to have visually similar tail protectors, but the “tail protector” is specifically mentioned as a feature in the Combat NATO 62 description. It is more obliquely referenced in the Combat NATO BC description… mentioned in the context of skin locking.

Also interesting about the skins. Synthetic skin material makes sense (it’s specifically mentioned in the Norwegian Army spec). Explained by the 40 day specified service life, which could be lot of mileage and rough use for troops on the move. It will be interesting to see if any special materials and construction techniques arise from this requirement. Kevlar weaves etc. Anything special could trickle down to us civilians.

The Rottefella BC Magnum compatibility is interesting too. Have seen NNN BC in military use before. Much more frequently than NN interestingly enough. The compatibility with standard military boots suggests that the Norwegian Army is looking for some kind of tech piece… maybe like the yellow ones the Canadians use on their arctic rig (see military ski thread).