New Åsnes Combat NATO 62 BC

[Manney]

You are correct. @Manney claimed to be quoting Asnes but provided incorrect info. Here is what it says on the Asnes page for the Sverdrup:

"tuned with more prominent camber and wax pocket than most of our other all-around BC skis."

Just saying. I don't appreciate to be quoted with just 2 phrases out of my post so that it is taken out of context and used to start a fire. I was just answering to Manney in a very straight forward and not agressive way that the Ingstad and Sverdrup were actually different skis. Not much, not less. I did not want to derail the thread and I dont like the direction it's taking.

Lulz, ok. Next time I am inclined to tell you that your assessment is correct per Asnes' own words, I'll just withhold that and let Manney spread disinfo.

There you go you, mca80. All my posts deleted. Thread’s all yours now.

Demystify things for us from your secret survivalist bunker. Or you can leave a handwritten note under a rock at Northern Highland or Sylvania if your tinfoil hat is blocking your burst transmitter signal. LOL..

[Stephen]

There you go you, mca80. All my posts deleted. Thread’s all yours now.

Demystify things for us from your secret survivalist bunker. Or you can leave a handwritten note under a rock at Northern Highland or Sylvania if your tinfoil hat is blocking your burst transmitter signal. LOL..

You’ve been more civil lately, but it’s this sort of thing that gets people throwing shade your way.
A downer, and completely unnecessary.

[Musk Ox]

The more one looks at the Asnes line, the more one sees a merging of lines… product streamlining… marketing by top sheet graphics.

Look at the specs of the Ingstad, Sverdrup, and NATO BC. Same dimensions. Only variations in weight are easily explained by things like a titanal plate (Sverdrup, NATO BC) or shorter length.

Now we have the new NATO Combat, which no longer distinguishes itself with a different incremental length. It would not be terribly surprising to learn that the basic materials and tooling for all three skis is identical. All three are described as having “moderate” (Asnes language) wax pockets too.

Idk anything about PE entering the equation, but things look a lot like product streamlining to me. Not that Asnes’ bloated product line ever made much sense. It’s a small company, the products serve a pretty narrow niche (they’re not Salomon, Madshus, Rossignol, or Fischer and cannot compete equally on these companies’ “scale”). Their catalogs are far “busier” than they need to be.

Just looked at prices of Asnes skis on Canadian web sites. Wow! Now the Canadian dollar is different than ours but the Asnes line is brushing up against full alpine pricing in that market. That’s akin to an Alpina Alaska being within 50 bucks of an alpine boot. That’s absurd to me… almost as if ppl in Asnes think that the pandemic pricing of two years ago set the bar. Which, of course, it didn’t.

The end of a global emergency will see a return to market driven (vice FOMO panic drivien) pricing. Simple supply and demand.

My money goes where the value lies. Any company hoping to fleece me with boutique pricing or mystique mumbo jumbo better start looking for a different guy to sell stuff to, because stepping off of any brand’s boat is easy if you never get hooked on the fanboy bullshit that brands like to create.

Let’s agree to disagree that Sverdrup is quite similar to Ingstad I own both and I have skied both extensively and I have not used the Ingstad much since I biught the Sverdrup. In my backyard conditions the Sverdrup is way more efficient for touring. The camber is more pronounced and stiffer underfoot than the Ingstad. If I had to travel in deep snow for a longer tour I would choose the Ingstad. I think the Sverdrup was designed when Åsnes was still family owned and maybe the new owners want to streamline the production to make it more profitable. But that is an assumption… don’t know when the change in ownership occurred and what is their strategy for the future. But for sure I am happy that I built my quiver in the last few years.

Again, I don’t w@nt to derail the original thread and let’s wait for some actual user review of the new Combat NATO.

This is a great thread and I refuse to let it burn!

I daresay there's an interesting point about Norwegian ski culture here, a bit, and it touches on the Åsnes lineup.

The Ingstad, Sverdrup and the NATO are very different skis beyond the top sheet, absolutely. While the geometry of those skis might be identical, the different weights and cores should give a clue as to how different they are.

These differences matter to us, because we're kind of nerdy, which is why we're discussing it on an Åsnes cult site an internet forum, But the context is kind of important I think.

Åsnes is principally oriented towards the Norwegian market, where the differences between fjellski, markaski and langrennski, for example, are understood by everyone in the sports shop, and every sports shop sells fjellski. Åsnes emphatically do 'compete equally' with Fischer, Rossignol, Salomon and poor Madshus here. Everyone's pretty clued up, and kind of flush with disposable income, and there's a set of old fjellski in every attic and garage... I don't think that the Åsnes product line seems quite as 'bloated' as it might from a North American perspective!

[Manney]

Everyone may be cashed up in Norway, but it’s a country of a few million people. Not enough to support any company operating beyond a certain scale. Elsewhere in the western world, property prices, food costs, and interest rates are climbing, That’s soaking up whatever cash people may have stashed away during the pandemic (assuming uninterrupted employment and health). But more to the matter at hand…

Perhaps you could explain the rational behind two Combat NATOs… or even the revised model? What niche is the new one filling in the fjellski, markaski and langrennski trinity? How does this differ from the old Combat NATO and the rest of the product line?

[Manney]

There you go you, mca80. All my posts deleted. Thread’s all yours now.

Demystify things for us from your secret survivalist bunker. Or you can leave a handwritten note under a rock at Northern Highland or Sylvania if your tinfoil hat is blocking your burst transmitter signal. LOL..

You’ve been more civil lately, but it’s this sort of thing that gets people throwing shade your way.
A downer, and completely unnecessary.

In case you’ve missed the clear and consistent trend, my role here isn’t to take shit. Not from anybody. Never the one to start it but am a quick study and a strong finisher.

Anyone wishing to test this can see what it gets them.

[Musk Ox]

Then what’s the rational behind two Combat NATOs? What niche is the new one filling in the fjellski, markaski and langrennski trinity?

It's a really good question, actually.

On the Norwegian language page, the 'classic' NATO is now called the NATO Jeger, or 'Hunter'.

It's going to be funny in the shop where both these skis will be next to each other with their identical minimalist topsheets, one with rocker, one without. Even by Åsnes's standards, this is going to make for sleepless nights when people are deciding which ones to get (I remember literal insomnia trying to decide between the MR48 and MT51 hung up on that 3mm difference in sidecut, and they're actually genuinely very different skis).

[Musk Ox]

Never the one to start it

Dude, come on.

[Musk Ox]

Everyone may be cashed up in Norway, but it’s a country of a few million people. Not enough to support any company operating beyond a certain scale. Elsewhere in the western world, property prices, food costs, and interest rates are climbing, That’s soaking up whatever cash people may have stashed away during the pandemic (assuming uninterrupted employment and health). But more to the matter at hand…

Good points. I'm just talking about the Norwegian context here... I don't know a thing about Åsnes's bottom line, though. I'm kind of thinking aloud about the way the product line doesn't seem as 'bloated' in Norway as it night in North America, really.

[Manney]

Then what’s the rational behind two Combat NATOs? What niche is the new one filling in the fjellski, markaski and langrennski trinity?

It's a really good question, actually.

On the Norwegian language page, the 'classic' NATO is now called the NATO Jeger, or 'Hunter'.

It's going to be funny in the shop where both these skis will be next to each other with their identical minimalist topsheets, one with rocker, one without. Even by Åsnes's standards, this is going to make for sleepless nights when people are deciding which ones to get (I remember literal insomnia trying to decide between the MR48 and MT51 with 3mm difference in sidecut, and they're actually genuinely very different skis).

The old ski was called the Jeger for years. Mentioned that in the military ski thread in fact. Probably good marketing reasons for that… not everyone wants to buy a ski with “combat” or “NATO” in the name. It would be like trying to sell an orange skin named Trump. Not everyone would buy it… LOL

Agree on the showroom floor challenge. That’s why somethings got to give… even if one is named Jeger and the other is named Combat. Too close visually and on the spec sheet.

The insomnia thing is certainly real to me. Thought long and hard about Ingstad and NATO. While doing so, other skis caught my eye. That’s not what Asnes would want to hear or see… best scenario is a quick decision and sale.

Now that the pandemic is mostly over, people will go into stores and face greater choice, fewer supply chain issues. So competition within a single brand isn’t ideal… it’s a kind of friction.

So one of these skis will die. Odds are it’s the old Combat NATO. Which gets back to the question of what’s the rationale behind the new one. Doesn’t appear to be anything significantly different… otherwise, wouldn’t Asnes be leaning on that as a selling point? (“It costs us less to make or we’re streamlining the range” isn’t anything that sells skis to a customer. Easy to sell in the boardroom tho. In the absence of anything to the contrary, this seems like a credible explanation for what’s happening here.)

[Manney]

Everyone may be cashed up in Norway, but it’s a country of a few million people. Not enough to support any company operating beyond a certain scale. Elsewhere in the western world, property prices, food costs, and interest rates are climbing, That’s soaking up whatever cash people may have stashed away during the pandemic (assuming uninterrupted employment and health). But more to the matter at hand…

Good points. I'm just talking about the Norwegian context here... I don't know a thing about Åsnes's bottom line, though. I'm kind of thinking aloud about the way the product line doesn't seem as 'bloated' in Norway as it night in North America, really.

Yep. Me to. We’re kicking around ideas. Good to have different perspectives, some cultural and some commercial.