Which Fischer ski for BCXC/XCD on firm/icy snow conditions?

[satanas]

Everything matters: overall stiffness, shape/sidecut, longitudinal stiffness, torsional stiffness(!), relative stiffness in different parts, edge sharpness, leverage from the boot/binding/skier, etc. On actual ice - or anything else really firm - you need sharp edges, plus enough stiffness and leverage. If not things can get hairy fast...

[randoskier]

Fischer Excursion 88 mounted with Xplore bindings and an Alfa boot of whatever stiffness you prefer. You can transition the flex on the Xplore from touring to downhill mode in about 15 seconds.

[JB TELE]

Fischer Excursion 88 mounted with Xplore bindings and an Alfa boot of whatever stiffness you prefer. You can transition the flex on the Xplore from touring to downhill mode in about 15 seconds.

I'm intrigued by the xplore binding and boots but I already have a pair of welted leather 75mm boots that fit me well and 2 skis mounted with 75mm bindings, so I don't have a good reason to switch. My general experience with new bcxc boots available in the united states is they are all very low quality compared to the old style of boots. Are alfas very high quality compared to alpina and fischer boots?

It's too bad that Alfa chose to distribute only through REI here in the states. The big chain that destroys the small, niche businesses where you can get the best advice.

[randoskier]

Fischer Excursion 88 mounted with Xplore bindings and an Alfa boot of whatever stiffness you prefer. You can transition the flex on the Xplore from touring to downhill mode in about 15 seconds.

I'm intrigued by the xplore binding and boots but I already have a pair of welted leather 75mm boots that fit me well and 2 skis mounted with 75mm bindings, so I don't have a good reason to switch. My general experience with new bcxc boots available in the united states is they are all very low quality compared to the old style of boots. Are alfas very high quality compared to alpina and fischer boots?

It's too bad that Alfa chose to distribute only through REI here in the states. The big chain that destroys the small, niche businesses where you can get the best advice.

Alfa is very high quality, but so is Alpina. I'm with you- when I change boots I will change bindings, not before. For my wife it was time to change boots last year and she needed new skis too so she went to the Xplore binding (early on!) from 75mm (which she had skied her entire life) and the Alfa Skaget on a Fischer 88, loves all three. Moi? I needed new skis but my boot was fine so I am still on the NNN BC, the Alaska, but also went to the Fischer 88 (from the Madshus Eon). Next year I plan to switch to the Xplore. Fischer boots in my experience are not so hot, great skis though (made in Ukraine until very recently). I did not know Alfa was at REI exclusively. Probably a smart move because they are a small Norwegian company and America is very expensive to do business in (at least they did not go Amazon!). I have never gotten much good technical advice from anyone at REI in either skiing or climbing, generally friendly though- student types and old hippy backpackers. I remember when REI was the little guy and one of the only places we could find climbing gear. Now they are a fashion house. I still visit REI about every 4 or 5 years or so when I am in the states- my bro lives in Seattle.

[JB TELE]

Lots of comments on going with a stiffer ski. Are all the fischer bcxc skis pretty soft? Is there another brand or model I should be looking at? Or should I be looking at old-school, super skinny downhill skis? Those BD syncro skis were very temping but they were 5cm too long to fit in my truck bed.

I took my s-bounds to a local ski resort that's closed on weekdays for some uphill laps. It was pretty firm and chalkboard like. Couldn't hold much of an edge when turning and ended up unintentionally slide slipping.

[JB TELE]

I'm thinking that fischer might not be the right brand for me and I would rather get the right thing than the best deal. Their skinny skis don't have enough sidecut and their skinniest sidecut ski, the otx 78, isn't far enough off in waist width from my s-bound 98. I'm hoping to get something significantly different in width.

Looking at asnes, they have skis with decent sidecut like my sbound 98 but in a skinner package. Maybe the nansen?

[DG99]

I'm thinking that fischer might not be the right brand for me and I would rather get the right thing than the best deal. Their skinny skis don't have enough sidecut and their skinniest sidecut ski, the otx 78, isn't far enough off in waist width from my s-bound 98. I'm hoping to get something significantly different in width.

Looking at asnes, they have skis with decent sidecut like my sbound 98 but in a skinner package. Maybe the nansen?

Was thinking about this today……
I don’t know about the Åsnes directly but they are high camber skis for XC so maybe not what you’re looking for re: old and icy snows. Could be nice just for a more trad skinny mileage thing vs the SBound 98s though, or get similar Fischers. True, narrower skis generally edge better on hardpack but really narrow high camber skis can be unstable underfoot.

I tried my new Scarpa T4s today on old refrozen trails, coral reef stuff. They worked ok on the Fischer Outback 68 skis, definitely MUCH more capable on reef than with the floppy BCX 675 boots. But still kinda sketchy with their high camber, light and brittle feel, not the greatest and getting hung up etc. The boot is a little overkill for the ski, and a bit of rocker launch due to the 3pins mounted directly on the ski, no ramp angle, but not unworkable like with T2s.
Then tried the Vector BCs with the T4s, much better although the skis tend to wander on packed blown out trail and are heavier. The Voile skis are true downhill skis so rock solid on tougher conditions compared to the XC skis.

So I’m thinking if you want a waxless ski that’s solid on icy snow, maybe get the Voile Objective BC. It’s not skinnier than the SB98s but there is more than narrowness in getting good edge hold. I’m sure they made with ice and corn descents in mind. I saw Tom M was using Objectives with Xplore boots so they apparently aren’t beasts that totally require plastic boots.

[DG99]

PS I noticed in an old thread that the Traverse 78 has a higher stiffer camber than the Outback 68, as well as more sidecut. So I guess it’s just a more advanced ski all around for faster kick and glide, and more turns, vs the more easygoing Outback. Who knew? The web sites rarely give a clue about camber.

[lilcliffy]

Looking at asnes, they have skis with decent sidecut like my sbound 98 but in a skinner package. Maybe the nansen?

The Nansen has less camber and smoother, rounder flex than the other Asnes "Fjellskis" (e.g. Sverdrup/Ingstad/Combat Nato)- it is Asnes' traditional xcD or "telemark" touring ski. The Nansen is still quite stiff and stable and holds a fantastic edge on icy/hardpack snow. There is no equivalent to this ski in either the Fischer or Madshus Nordic ski lines.

Can't remember- Do you want/need a "waxless" scaled base?

[DG99]

Looking at asnes, they have skis with decent sidecut like my sbound 98 but in a skinner package. Maybe the nansen?

The Nansen has less camber and smoother, rounder flex than the other Asnes "Fjellskis" (e.g. Sverdrup/Ingstad/Combat Nato)- it is Asnes' traditional xcD or "telemark" touring ski. The Nansen is still quite stiff and stable and holds a fantastic edge on icy/hardpack snow. There is no equivalent to this ski in either the Fischer or Madshus Nordic ski lines.

Can't remember- Do you want/need a "waxless" scaled base?

Oh, that’s interesting, maybe a bit like those original BD SynchroX etc, a skinny ski for downhill and edging. A rare beast anymore.

Some reports on this site apparently say the Åsnes fishscale is barely adequate in grip and you’ll probably want kicker skins to back it up depending on snow and slope angle, vs. the more aggressive Fischer and Voile patterns.

Does anybody actually use the Blue Klister what is for ice?