I had no idea you could go downhill on XC skis...video proof

[JeffXCD]

Low angle with wide boards is done around Mid-Michigan to help surf the shrubbery. ...Wide boards do seem to help w both regular float and trash surfing. Skiing over sticks and glancing off bark is all way less of a bother.

[JeffXCD]

At least the Powder reporter asked questions instead of just claiming to know. Why would someone make their life harder? And noting that for sure there'd be more crashes. Well... sliding out in the snow or even high-siding while using light gear is no big deal, it's part of skiing, often part of turns. Who cares. And as for making it harder, I've been trying to get comfy with modern tele gear recently, then took a visit back to my old-time gear and it wasn't harder at all! It flowed easier! It's so light! ...Like one commenter here said: the flexy stuff is easily conformed to whatever you need it to do. A friend warned me before my retro revisit that I was going to confirm that old stuff sucked. That didn't happen! I just started smiling. It was like re-meeting an old friend! I'm old now but dropped right back into confident ease. So there's that...

[Manney]

Nice skiing, @Erik H. Good to see young, eager skiers who are willing to try new things on the forum. You’re the future of this sport.

[JohnSKepler]

^^ This.

Hilarious when ppl express the need for plastic boots, tech bindings, and carving skis for backcountry tele… the low angle stuff in the northeast and midwest, not skimo. Usually a sign that they started skiing late in life, didn’t develop solid technique and skills, skipped ski lessons, or became dependent on equipment to do things they should be capable of.

NN, NNN BC, or Xplore + a full boot with support, low camber, edged BC ski is enough to get started. Never too late.

I began late in life, very late in life, don't have solid technique, and have never had a ski lesson. This past year I went with a plastic boot, Meidjo, carving ski set up. I found I much prefer, and do better, with my Alaska Xplore boot and Xplore binding. I will admit, I prefer this kind of skiing with my Voile Objective+Xplore or Asnes FT62 set up but was getting better at it on my Gammes when the snow all melted. I suck, and I always will, but I'm very eager to get back to it this winter! And, every time I see a video like this I learn something new.

As for the question in the article: "Although impressiveness aside, I don't fully understand why you wouldn't just opt for a proper backcountry setup if you plan on doing some downhill skiing. You don't win anything for making your life harder." Going up or flat is at least half of back country skiing and I simply hate that part in BC gear. Any BC skier who hasn't tried proper XC BC gear just doesn't know what they are missing.

[Manney]

Happy to hear it, John. It’s always been about matching systems to conditions. Bunny boots and strap bindings in the Arctic/Antarctic, plastic boots in alpine, real flexible on the flats, and something in between in the middle ground.

Ski companies love rad. They love selling maur power. LOL. Even to people who won’t, or can’t, use it. But they mostly love money… yours, mine, and whoever is willing to hawk a kidney to buy their gear. They love money more than skiing because the board bonuses work on money, not stoke.

The problem to me isn’t buying into this… people can spend their own money however they want. It’s rejecting common sense, legitimizing a heavy setup for pedestrian (intentionally using this word) skiing, and telling people who know otherwise that they don’t know what their talking about.

Heavy skiing, heavy gear? Get it.
Moderate skiing, moderate gear? Get it.
Light skiing, light gear? Get it.
Light gear, heavy skiing? Props to that.
Heavy gear, light skiing? Yawn, ROFL.

None of us will never be as good as we’d like to be. That’s the reality of being human. We just need to put aside the pretences and focus on mastering the gear designed to get the job done.

[connyro]

Happy to hear it, John. It’s always been about matching systems to conditions. Bunny boots and strap bindings in the Arctic/Antarctic, plastic boots in alpine, real flexible on the flats, and something in between in the middle ground.

Ski companies love rad. They love selling maur power. LOL. Even to people who won’t, or can’t, use it. But they mostly love money… yours, mine, and whoever is willing to hawk a kidney to buy their gear. They love money more than skiing because the board bonuses work on money, not stoke.

The problem to me isn’t buying into this… people can spend their own money however they want. It’s rejecting common sense, legitimizing a heavy setup for pedestrian (intentionally using this word) skiing, and telling people who know otherwise that they don’t know what their talking about.

Heavy skiing, heavy gear? Get it.
Moderate skiing, moderate gear? Get it.
Light skiing, light gear? Get it.
Light gear, heavy skiing? Props to that.
Heavy gear, light skiing? Yawn, ROFL.

None of us will never be as good as we’d like to be. That’s the reality of being human. We just need to put aside the pretences and focus on mastering the gear designed to get the job done.

I'm not looking to pick a fight, scout's honor. I occasionally ski with a group of skiers, one of whom is a woman with an ankle injury that occurred when she was a kid. She uses widesh scales skis and plastic boots. Shes not skiing anything rad, she gets out into the bc with confidence and comfort with her heavy gear and light skiing. If she didn't have that gear, she would most likely not be skiing. Manney, your strict rules for what skis to use when, outlined above don't work in the real world. Each skier has unique needs and don't need to justify to you why they choose the gear that they do.

[Manney]

The key points are

“telling people who know otherwise that they don’t know what their talking about” and being honest about your skiing.

If you need to use Hoks because you have a weight issue, balance problem or are a novice skier, who the hell is anyone to question that? If you skip over that and tell ppl that anyone who skis knows they’re the only way to go, you’re distorting the truth by omission.

Don’t care what people ski. Don’t care where they ski. Don’t care how well they ski. But when they distort reality to suit their purposes, ego etc, then bullshit must be called.

Recall reading one discussion about k&g. Skier speed was 3.5 to 4 mph. That’s a normal walking pace for an adult male. Look it up.

There might be kick going on but it’s going to be weak. There might be more slide than glide. Yet this was used to illustrate just how good their wide skis were on the flats. This left me wondering if the skier knew what k&g was… what skiing was. You can walk in snowshoes at 3.5 mph. There was a lot of pushback when this was challenged (Not by me… it happened long before joining).

No further clarification or qualification was given. Flame war ensued.

To the novice, the main take aways would have been (1) wide skis are good for the flats (2) skiing on the flats at 3.5 to 4 mph is actually good. This is bullshit. Skiing was invented to cross distances faster than walking pace when conditions favored them over snowshoes (which were an earlier invention). Look it up.

If the skier mentioned a physical challenge, then perspective would have been established. Nobody with any interpersonal skills would have challenged this. Indeed, many would congratulate skiing despite the physical challenge. None of use are superhuman.

Without qualifying things, the relationship between gear weight/complexity and speed/conditions stands.

[connyro]

...Don’t care what people ski. Don’t care where they ski. Don’t care how well they ski....

Ok, but you JUST got done saying :

Heavy skiing, heavy gear? Get it.
Moderate skiing, moderate gear? Get it.
Light skiing, light gear? Get it.
Light gear, heavy skiing? Props to that.
Heavy gear, light skiing? Yawn, ROFL.

So there's a contradiction in your messages.

[Manney]

...Don’t care what people ski. Don’t care where they ski. Don’t care how well they ski....

Ok, but you JUST got done saying :

Heavy skiing, heavy gear? Get it.
Moderate skiing, moderate gear? Get it.
Light skiing, light gear? Get it.
Light gear, heavy skiing? Props to that.
Heavy gear, light skiing? Yawn, ROFL.

So there's a contradiction in your messages.

Also note the language. “Caring” doesn’t enter into any of it. Understanding it or respecting it does.

Without qualifying things, the relationship between gear weight/complexity and speed/conditions stands.

I'm not looking to pick a fight, scout's honor.

Doesn’t always seem that way.

Well lookie here - Manney's got a thread going that's got some importance to himself. It'd be a real shame if something happened to it: say, something like it got derailed or sent off-topic.

[mca80]

You can walk in snowshoes at 3.5 mph.

Doesn't really affect your argument or point much, but this would require a very specific snow condition. In general, snowshoeing will be much slower than walking on dry, firm ground. You're right, though, 4mph skiing on flat is certainly not something to aspire to.