Fischer S-Bound vs Madshus Panorama

[lilcliffy]

I'm glad to read that you love the Saguenay. I personally live in Sainte-Rose-du-Nord. I don't know if you've been there, but it is absolutely beautiful. So I recommend it for a future trip in Saguenay if you haven't been there already.

I know exactly where Sainte-Rose-du-Nord is! BEAUTIFUL.
My wife and I used to make two trips to that region each year- one in the summer- one in the winter-
we love hiking (and skiing!) in the parcs- and kayaking on the fjord.
This is one of our most favorite places on Earth.

Long story short, I first bought a pair of Discovery 102 paired with Voile 3-pins and cable (but never really used the cable) and Alpina Alaska 75. These boots didn't last a month. I returned them and got Alfa Greenland boots. Those resisted for a winter and a half before they broke.

What you describe here↑ is what pushed me towarsd NNNBC for BC-XC Nordic ski touring.

Last year, I got a pair of T4s and I bought the V6 equipped with a Switchback (I already owned a pair of old T2s that I use for more challenging downhill). I skied the whole winter with T4s, whether I was skiing the Discovery or the V6. T4 and Discovery 102 isn't a great fit. I find these boots too bulky for XC oriented tours. But they sure help on the descent!

Yes- agree (D-102 +T4 is not a good match); yes- agree (T4 to "bulky" for XC oriented tours); yes- agree (T4 is very supportive downhill!).

BTW- I really want a V6...I have a Kom- otherwise I wouldn't hesitate to just buy a V6. But, I want that ski...

Maybe that ''floating'' isn't exactly the right term to describe what I meant. I want a ski that mostly stays above the snowpack.

This is what I thought you meant.

The Discovery sinks too much. I find it inefficient when skiing in powder on the flats (lake or ungroomed trail or forest) and hard to control when I go down off-track. With more rocker, I believe, I will have more control and will skip some of the hazards hidden in the snow (branches mostly) when going down even if I don't float well above the snowpack. And I also think I will be more efficient on ungroomed flats. I mean, the V6 floats like a charm. So, I don't need something too similar.

Got it. Makes sense.

I've tried the Kom with two different setups. They were borrowed the two times. When I tried them with NNN-BC, they were wobbling and it was not fun when I was skiing on packed snow. However, on fresh snow, it is quite nice. I also tried them with Switchbacks and my T2s in a Downhill oriented tour and they were really fun. But I consider as well that they are redundant with the V6 and I don't need them.

On durability, thank you, again, for your advice. It will not be my first criteria when choosing a ski but I think it's always good to consider it. If a ski has poor durability it's a no-go but if it is medium or better it's good enough to me. To my understanding, ski with scales will deteriorate faster since you can't do anything to repair scales and can't do much to prevent wear. So, unfortunately, durability will never be perfect with scaled skis.

With everything that you and others have written, I think that I'll try the SB98 189cm. I think that the local shop that sells them has a one week try period when you buy skis. So if they don't feel right I will return them. But I'll still take the weekend to think this through.

Wonderful that you can test and return skis!!! WOW.
(I need to work on this with my local shop!!)
I am about to pick up an S-Bound 98 as well- mounted to XP.

Very cool mon ami!
Keep in touch and let us know how you make out!
Best wishes from Nouveau-Brunswick,
Gareth

[lilcliffy]

@wabene
Cool.
Thanks for sharing all of those details!
Those M62s look very cool. Wish Madhshus was brave enough to pursue that design pathway...I was hoping for a wax "M78" in that design profile- it was temporarily on the Madshus site, but I never saw one for sale... So no rocker on your M62 eh? Well, perhaps the temporary "redesign" wasn't as significant as I thought...

I have seen your model of the S98 in my local shop. Your description seems consistent (and also consistent with TomM's report and video on this model). So- less cambered than the S-98 has been in recent years, but still stiffer than a Madshus 68/78.

I have the current S-98 on order from my local shop- I hope it has the same camber-flex profile as yours.
(I didn't like the S-98 that had the same camber as the 88...)

[wabene]

@wabene
Cool.
Thanks for sharing all of those details!
Those M62s look very cool. Wish Madhshus was brave enough to pursue that design pathway...I was hoping for a wax "M78" in that design profile- it was temporarily on the Madshus site, but I never saw one for sale... So no rocker on your M62 eh? Well, perhaps the temporary "redesign" wasn't as significant as I thought...

I have seen your model of the S98 in my local shop. Your description seems consistent (and also consistent with TomM's report and video on this model). So- less cambered than the S-98 has been in recent years, but still stiffer than a Madshus 68/78.

I have the current S-98 on order from my local shop- I hope it has the same camber-flex profile as yours.
(I didn't like the S-98 that had the same camber as the 88...)

You must have the new black 98 on order. I really like my 98. It is the ski I learned to turn on. I've used a skin on this ski to haul a toboggan over a big hill into a cabin for 5 days of skiing. It was then a blast on the downhill bits. Then when covering ground on the flats it tracks nicely, I think due to the center groove. That is one thing I think that's missed with the Madshus skis. My M62 can be fast and fun in a little fresh snow or some skied in tracks. It can also get squirrelly on smooth hard pack. It's not like your are looking to smear turns with the 62, so why no groove? Maybe you don't need a groove on the 78, but for sure on the 62 and 68. Also since I'm ranting, how about a wax based version of the 98? In colder temps that could be the ticket.

[Sidney Dunkin]

Wabene, I agree it would be great to have a waxable ski for when conditions are right, but does it have to be a s98? Why not wax up one of your alpine skis if you have one. Even my widest alpine ski will tour better than my best scaled ski when waxed in good dry conditions, especially if they have a free pivot binding.

[wabene]

Wabene, I agree it would be great to have a waxable ski for when conditions are right, but does it have to be a s98? Why not wax up one of your alpine skis if you have one. Even my widest alpine ski will tour better than my best scaled ski when waxed in good dry conditions, especially if they have a free pivot binding.

That is a good point SD and would make LowangleAl proud! There is already the Rabb as well if you want that kicker skin.

[Sidney Dunkin]

Wabene, I agree it would be great to have a waxable ski for when conditions are right, but does it have to be a s98? Why not wax up one of your alpine skis if you have one. Even my widest alpine ski will tour better than my best scaled ski when waxed in good dry conditions, especially if they have a free pivot binding.

That is a good point SD and would make LowangleAl proud! There is already the Rabb as well if you want that kicker skin.

Ha ha ha, we do seem to be cut from the same cloth.

Do you have a Rabb and do kicker skins work for your kind of yo yo skiing?

[wabene]

Wabene, I agree it would be great to have a waxable ski for when conditions are right, but does it have to be a s98? Why not wax up one of your alpine skis if you have one. Even my widest alpine ski will tour better than my best scaled ski when waxed in good dry conditions, especially if they have a free pivot binding.

That is a good point SD and would make LowangleAl proud! There is already the Rabb as well if you want that kicker skin.

Ha ha ha, we do seem to be cut from the same cloth.

Do you have a Rabb and do kicker skins work for your kind of yo yo skiing?

I don't have the Rabb. I do have many skis with kicker skins. They are great for pulling a toboggan for trips into the cabin, but I don't like them for laps. They work great getting up the hill, but are slow coming down. Plus the feel isn't as good. So for low angle laps it's scales or wax for me.

[André18]

Monday morning update. I called the local shop. They don't have the SB98 in store as we are speaking. I'm gonna order one and it should be there by mid-February. I'll keep you all in touch when I get to test it. I'm still gonna head to the city today to try the Skaget and see if it's a good fit. It's a bit of a bummer, I was really eager to get this ski.

@lilcliffy
Wow! I'm glad to know you love Ste-Rose so much. Do you still come around here often?
The V6: I understand you wanna buy it so bad. It's such a special ski. GREAT DH ski. (But I'm sure you are well aware.) What kind of boot/binding would you use with it? What kind of terrain would you use it for?

Best regards

[lilcliffy]

@lilcliffy
Wow! I'm glad to know you love Ste-Rose so much. Do you still come around here often?

Our third child is non-verbal autistic- he needs 24hr care and supervision-
For example- he went outside for 3 hours last night and waded knee deep snow on his bicycle at -20C!!!
Our son is wonderful, and I love being his parent- but, his needs do result in that we are unable to travel as a couple or family. I am very grateful to live in interior rural New Brunswick, where there is limitless outdoor adventures- right from my backyard- and where we get good snow!

The V6: I understand you wanna buy it so bad. It's such a special ski. GREAT DH ski. (But I'm sure you are well aware.) What kind of boot/binding would you use with it? What kind of terrain would you use it for?

I would put a 75mm Telemark touring binding on it (eg Voile Switchback)- and use my Scarpa T4 boot- but, at this point I would consider TTS in the future, depending on boots.
In New Brunswick- all of the good downhill terrain is densely forested- and therefore, really only safe to ski in good snow conditions. I would use the V6 to downhill ski tour in hardwood glades in deep soft snow.

[flapped]

Hence the Panorama and the S-Bound. According to my research, they are skis that have the characteristics I am looking for. I understand that everyone has their favorites. Do you all think that both of these skis travel well (enough) on the flats (no wobble) and have good scales?

The Fischer models have grippier scale design.
They all "wander"/"wobble"- you need a long length to try and reduce this.

One thing that has a surprisingly large effect on the wandering effect on hard snow is a center groove in the bottom. My Panorama M62s don't have it, my girlfriend's Åsnes Cecilies do, and the difference is a very noticeable one. But that's only on hard snow, if there's even a couple of centimeters of soft snow, my 192cm M62s go very steadily.