Alfa vs Alfa

[randoskier]

Got my Lundhags Guides today, going back tomorrow. I found them extremely low volume throughout the boot.

I think their inner liner is thin and poorly made (an expesnive consumable) and thin liner not a good system for a ski boot to begin with. It is based on their hiking/hunting boot system with an inner boot for "quick drying" of the boot. If you have walked in the summer in hiking boots in Scandi-land you WILL have had wet feet and wet boots, it is largely a big wet bog- there are also some river crossings where you should keep your boots on. So it is nice to be able to dry the boot rapidly and this inner-system makes perfect sense for a hunting/hiking boot.

Is extreme wetness in a ski boot a common problem when touring up there? Not in my experience, and I bet I could dry my damp Alaskas with a couple of sheets of newspaper in just about the same time as these Lundhags.

Guess I am not a Lundhags guy (I also like Norway MUCH better than Sweden). I wanted to like these boots...but..
guess I am an Alfa male....

So bring on the next victim- Alfa. I have never tried Alfa boots, but I now have my eye on two models-

The Kikut Perform (formerly Quest) and the Skarvet Advance.

My needs- a comfortable long range NNN BC touring boot with reasonable support.

I was quite happy with the Alaska except for the damn narrow toe-box.

Johnny really raved about the Kikut back in 2018. Sounds like a really comfortable boot, I wonder how warm it is? How supportive? It looks really light.

When I am touring up in Norway I see the Skarvet on the feets more than any other boot, they must have made this boot for the past thirty years or something. It looks like a classic winner BUT it also looks like it takes forever to break-in and the heel might possibly be a blister-machine?? Being old all of a sudden, I don't want to take two months to break-in a new boot or leave a trail of oozing blister-plasters strewn across the beautiful Norwegian fells.

Both these boots are reportedly high volume and are touring machines designed for Scandi-tours. Both are about the same price (within 40 EUR).

Does anyone have experience with either, or even better both, of these boots? How was the fit and break-in? Any cautionary tales or raves? Which one and for what?

Well???? Let 'er rip. Inquiring minds want to know.

[fisheater]

I don’t see Gareth posting as often, but I’m sure he could offer some assistance. Here goes the bat signal, @lilcliffy if you get some time, we could use your expertise.
Thanks, Bob

[socaltim]

You might have a look at these Salomon Escape Outbacks
https://www.rei.com/product/211595/salo ... -ski-boots
I had settled on these or the Alaska's, mainly because that is what I could try on at REI near me. Unfortunately, I can't do head-to-head compare because the 44 Alaska's I mistakenly ordered were too small for my size 11 feet. 45 in these Salomon's fit perfect and they feel nice walking around the block with liner sock + medium heavy wool sock. I did have a bit of heel slippage until I saw this tip for putting a "Surgeon's knot" right where top of foot meets leg.
https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice ... boots.html
I have not been out on the skis yet, and these are my first BC boots, so can't say much but have a look. They are lighter than the Alaska's, with a little less support above the ankles. But, they seem very sturdy and well made. One of the reviews remarked on wide toe box.

[randoskier]

I don't trust Solomon. I had a pair of their hiking boots recently- Solomon refuses to use Vibram soles and makes their own- they wore out very quickly- in this ski boot they made their own fake Goretex- they do not have that level of technology. I wouldn't touch that boot, they have little expertise in the BC field and are always trying to be different...remember SNS bindings?

If your Alpina Alaska boots fit you then you have great boot! Top.

I am leaning towards the Alfa Kikut Perform. I might order both the Kikut and the Skarvet and send back the one I don't like. I hope 45 will fit me with the thick Norwegian wool socks I wear.

[sjniles]

I picked up a pair of Alfa Skarvets on eBay a year and a half ago in basically unused condition. I typically wear 10.5/44 in most shoes and boots and have a fairly wide foot and long toes.I got a 44. They are great boots, roomy in the toe box and fit well except they give me a terrible blister on one heel. I have tried taping my heel and typically wear a thin polypro sock under a thick wool sock. I’m going to try some ezefit blister protection socks this season. I’d like to make them work but we’ll see.
I have another pair of similar Alfa boots , not sure which model, size 43 that I can only wear with really thin socks. They don’t have the heel issue but are really too small for me.

[lilcliffy]

We have the Kikut here- and the Guard BC (which is reportedly identical in terms of fit as the Vista XP)

Tom M has owned both the current Skarvet as well as the Vista/Guard- you should ask Tom about the fit of the Skarvet.
The Guard/Vista is marketed as the "heavy-duty" version of the Skarvet- I don't know if that means that the fit is identical between the two. Ask Tom.

Both the Kikut and the Guard are wide and large volume- with a wide open heel with no contour to the heel-achilles-
and that hard plastic heel can be a bit brutal- depending on the shape of your heel-achilles.
Neither boot fits me very well- my heel is narrow, and there is a significant curve to my narrow heel-achilles- leading to a relatively thick calf. The Kikut/Guard is ideal for someone with a thick, high-volume heel and ankle (my son fits this profile, and both of these boots are ideal for him).

[Tom M]

Ive owned and skied the Skarvet, Greenland (75mm version of the Skarvet), Vista (Xplore version of the Guard), and the Free. All good boots, but require time to break in. The heel pocket on my Skarvets were a blister issue for me the first season, but not a problem as time went on. I really like the Vistas and if I were in the market for a new NNNBC boot, I'd probably pick the Guard over the Skarvet if the budget allowed. I put a lot of miles on my Skarvets/Greenlands and they held up very well. I no longer have those boots as all of my off trail XC skis are Xplore mounts.

[randoskier]

Ive owned and skied the Skarvet, Greenland (75mm version of the Skarvet), Vista (Xplore version of the Guard), and the Free. All good boots, but require time to break in. The heel pocket on my Skarvets were a blister issue for me the first season, but not a problem as time went on. I really like the Vistas and if I were in the market for a new NNNBC boot, I'd probably pick the Guard over the Skarvet if the budget allowed. I put a lot of miles on my Skarvets/Greenlands and they held up very well. I no longer have those boots as all of my off trail XC skis are Xplore mounts.

Thanks for that Tom. The way the winter is shaping up (or not) here in Italy it does not look like I will have proper time to break-in a pair of Skarvets before I head up to northern Norway/Sweden for a couple of two-week long tours. So I guess I am going to go with the Alfa Kikut for this season, if it fits ok. It looks like a comfortable touring boot that will need little break-in, Johnny seemed to like it in his 2018 review. It is also very light, probably not the most durable boot, but I will be happy if I get two seasons out of it.

I'm with you on the X-plore, but I don't want to change all of my skis over so passed on it, my wife was an early adopter and loves it, she has the Alfa Skaget Perform and finds it super comfortable for long tours. I think the Xplore is the future for touring, it does not seem to have any more reliability issues than any of the other binding options out there.

BTW Whatever became of Johnny the site administrator? Any idea? The site directory says he is inactive.

[randoskier]

We have the Kikut here- and the Guard BC (which is reportedly identical in terms of fit as the Vista XP)

Tom M has owned both the current Skarvet as well as the Vista/Guard- you should ask Tom about the fit of the Skarvet.
The Guard/Vista is marketed as the "heavy-duty" version of the Skarvet- I don't know if that means that the fit is identical between the two. Ask Tom.

Both the Kikut and the Guard are wide and large volume- with a wide open heel with no contour to the heel-achilles-
and that hard plastic heel can be a bit brutal- depending on the shape of your heel-achilles.
Neither boot fits me very well- my heel is narrow, and there is a significant curve to my narrow heel-achilles- leading to a relatively thick calf. The Kikut/Guard is ideal for someone with a thick, high-volume heel and ankle (my son fits this profile, and both of these boots are ideal for him).

Thanks Gareth, was the Kikut supportive enough in descent? That is descents on long tours, I do not mean completely downhill oriented. Is it comparable to the Alaska in that respect? Thanks again.
,

[lilcliffy]

Hi Rando,
Your welcome and I meant to speak to that-

In terms of support- none of Alfa's classic backcountry Nordic touring boots reach the level of even the Alpina Alaska BC-
(newer designs such as the Skaget and Free are much more supportive)

Even the "heavy-duty" Guard is extremely soft and supple. The Kikut feels like wearing a slipper/moccasin (which is partly why Johnny loves it I think!). Both the Guard and the Kikut also have very soft, flexible (perhaps some might say unstable?) soles. I would think the XP version of the Guard (Vista XP) has a stiffer sole?

The Kikut has thin treated roughout leather ("nubuck") with a goretex bootie and moderate insulation. It is not as warm as the Guard (nor as warm as the Alaska BC). My close friend has a pair that he regularly uses- it is ultralight, very soft and comfy, but it is not a supportive boot- think very light, soft trail hikers.

The Guard has beautiful full-grain leather that is very soft and supple. Alfa claims that the upper is reinforced for extra stability- I don't feel anything significant there (Tom M would be able to compare the supportiveness vs the Skarvet). The Guard has a goretex bootie and thick insulation, plus lots of comfy padding around the ankle. The midsole of the Guard is also insulated. The Guard is incredibly warm- warmer than the Alaska BC- it is the warmest classic Nordic touring boot currently available that I am aware of. The Guard also has a complete protective rand- that plus the full-grain leather, go a long way to making it more durable than the Kikut. The Guard is light, moderately supportive, and ultrawarm- think ultralight back-packing boot.

When Alfa uses the term "heavy-duty" to describe the Guard- I think that they primarily mean warmth and durability- though they do claim that the Guard is more supportive than the Skarvet- Tom can probably confirm this.

If the Guard is more supportive than the Skarvet- and you want similar support as the Alaska BC- you are going to be disapointed with the support of the Skarvet.

If you want an Alfa BC boot- I think that you should be considering the Guard BC.